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In pursuit of self-actualization and happiness

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Feb 3, 2012
Messages
4,050
Location
Philippines
#1
As the sole male bearing our family name, I had the ideal of being "a decent father and husband" as my main motivation for self-growth during my younger years. It's a rather impossible task (since I believe that I'll be shitty on both roles forever) but it helped me work on my finances, education and career growth and reign in the Ne indecisiveness.

The problem with the ideal is that my wife is challenging it by well, telling me how proud she is of me as of now and how satisfied she is with what I'm doing even though I'm just doing normal husband duties. Months of that assurance is going into my head and making me challenge my perception of myself.

So I asked her, "if I actually managed to get a hang of said ideal, then what's next to do?"

"Be happy" she says.

Easy for her to say, given that she already been self-actualized with a good job, a good educational background and in her opinion, a good husband.

So here I am looking at the infinite abyss that is Ne finding a path to my own happiness and self-actualization.
 
Local time
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#2
It sounds like you're in this weird equilibrium where society is happy with you, but deep down you're not happy. The logical thing to do is to weigh the pros and cons of staying where you're at, but something tells me this is not a problem logic can help out with.

The obvious thing to do is to ask yourself why you're not satisfied. How do you actually feel about where you're at? What if this is all there is to it from here, would you be okay with that?

Ne looks for possibilities until reality collapses it into more concrete, Si. That means the restlessness is going to remain until something becomes certain. Either your situation changes or you change it. Energy has to flow somewhere eventually.
 

Hadoblado

I em Hedo I like smell of grass
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Mar 17, 2011
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#3
You've realised being a good husband, is being a good dad still on the cards?
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
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Tomorrow, 05:13
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Messages
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Philippines
#4
You've realised being a good husband, is being a good dad still on the cards?
Not at the moment since we are not planning for kids during our first few years. Maybe if we get a place in the provinces. Cities are so polluted :(
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
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Messages
4,050
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Philippines
#5
It sounds like you're in this weird equilibrium where society is happy with you, but deep down you're not happy. The logical thing to do is to weigh the pros and cons of staying where you're at, but something tells me this is not a problem logic can help out with.
Yup, welcome to collectivism :P I'll wager that what I'm feeling is a common problem in the East, probably worse in more hierarchal societies.

Aside from the not having kids yet, I'm basically a proper son/husband in society's perspective.

The obvious thing to do is to ask yourself why you're not satisfied. How do you actually feel about where you're at? What if this is all there is to it from here, would you be okay with that?

Ne looks for possibilities until reality collapses it into more concrete, Si. That means the restlessness is going to remain until something becomes certain. Either your situation changes or you change it. Energy has to flow somewhere eventually.
Oddly, the restlessness is partly because I think my old and new families "deserve better" which is being gradually dispelled because they're kinda okay with the way I'm doing things. I think the underlying restlessness beneath that is "Hey, are you actually going to spend your life doing this for them even if they're both okay with you developing yourself instead?".

I'm learning programming to see if I can mix it with my old skills. Probably will help me find a fresh field to work on (which will give me enough competition to be passionate and come alive) and give my Ne something to chew on.
 

redbaron

consummate salt-extraction specialist
Local time
Tomorrow, 07:13
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Jun 10, 2012
Messages
6,628
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38S 145E
#6
get a pet

people with animals are happier than people with kids

and if you can't even handle a pet, you know not to have kids later
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
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Philippines
#8
get a pet

people with animals are happier than people with kids

and if you can't even handle a pet, you know not to have kids later
I was the caretaker of the family pets so I can handle them well. Cant keep them on our currently rented house though so I have to make do with the strays in the univ.
 

Polaris

Radioactive vision
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Oct 13, 2009
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1,949
#9
I think it is very important for the overall health of a relationship that both parties are happy with their own personal achievements/development. While some people are seemingly happy to invest all their resources in the other person, and/or ultimately their children, that doesn't work for everyone. It sounds like you are aware of that and already taking steps to change things for yourself, which will also indirectly benefit your wife. While some would be contented to be "just" a good husband, I could not imagine that being a very satisfying path for someone of stronger intellectual and/or driven makeup. It sound like your wife is aware of that, and sort of discretely challenging you, which is great. If you are already bored in your current position, it would be a sign for you to change something, which you are doing with your programming course already.

From personal experience, I know I will die 'spiritually' the day I stop challenging myself. There is not a single person in this world that can make me as happy as I am when I am learning new things and overcoming intellectual and creative challenges.
 

Serac

Prolific Member
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#10
What sort of validation (or alternatively, the lack thereof) you're getting from other people, including your sweetie, should have no bearing whatsoever on what you think of your own self-actualization and whether you are achieving the things you want to achieve in life. Most people's instinct is to try to make you as predictable and manageable as possible, and try to make you feel content with whatever you have or whatever they provide you with in life. Only the most confident, and the ones with carefully devised ethics, can afford you to be totally free to pursue your own goals.
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
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#11
From personal experience, I know I will die 'spiritually' the day I stop challenging myself. There is not a single person in this world that can make me as happy as I am when I am learning new things and overcoming intellectual and creative challenges.
That's a nice persoective you have Polaris. Perhaps if I see it that way I'll feel more alive for myself.
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
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Philippines
#12
What sort of validation (or alternatively, the lack thereof) you're getting from other people, including your sweetie, should have no bearing whatsoever on what you think of your own self-actualization and whether you are achieving the things you want to achieve in life. Most people's instinct is to try to make you as predictable and manageable as possible, and try to make you feel content with whatever you have or whatever they provide you with in life. Only the most confident, and the ones with carefully devised ethics, can afford you to be totally free to pursue your own goals.
I dont have a problem with motivation and confidence per se, I think the problem is that the goals are not mine/for me.

Let me put it this way.

Currently: I want to study X because my family needs the status and the extra income.

What I want: I want to study X because its fun and makes me happy.

The "current" style made me finish one of the hardest courses at one of the most gruelling Univs here and got me a sweet academic position. I got our family prestige but I feel miserable since they were means to an end and I dont enjoy what Im doing.
 

Serac

Prolific Member
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#13
@Pyropyro I guess you have to make a choice then. I'm not gonna claim to know which one is best because I don't know the intricacies of your life. But at the very least, you seem to see the situation quite clearly yourself.

Were you doing biology and now want to do computer-science? As far as I know, there's a pretty big field which is at the intersection of that – computational biology.
 

QuickTwist

Pawn who fights for injustice
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Different day, different place
#14
A lot of Eastern societies are shame-based cultures. That's probably why you feel you are not measuring up when all the evidence is pretty much the opposite.

When I say shame-based cultures, what I really mean is that there is usually an honor system in place so that things don't end awry. It's based on the idea that you don't want to bring shame to your family/city/country whathaveyou. In theory, it's a really good idea to model a society based on this... That is... if it wasn't for people constantly feeling shame about everything. I mean, sure, society functions perfectly fine... It's just that Japan tends to have one of the highest suicide rates in the world (I think). I know you are from the Philippines, but my point was that a lot of Eastern cultures have this problem.
 
Local time
Today, 14:13
Joined
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Messages
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#15
Oddly, the restlessness is partly because I think my old and new families "deserve better" which is being gradually dispelled because they're kinda okay with the way I'm doing things. I think the underlying restlessness beneath that is "Hey, are you actually going to spend your life doing this for them even if they're both okay with you developing yourself instead?".

I'm learning programming to see if I can mix it with my old skills. Probably will help me find a fresh field to work on (which will give me enough competition to be passionate and come alive) and give my Ne something to chew on.
Hm. So right now you know that your life situation is not ideal. But at the same time you do not know what is your ideal situation. You are introducing variation to your career by learning programming with the possibility of reaching that unknown ideal situation. Am I getting close?
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
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#16
@Pyropyro
Were you doing biology and now want to do computer-science? As far as I know, there's a pretty big field which is at the intersection of that – computational biology.
I was thinking of working on its sister field, bioinformatics. Computational biologists seems to be programmers/mathematicians who learned that they can apply their stuff to biology. Bioinfo on the other hand are biologists who learned some bit of programming.
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
Local time
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Joined
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Philippines
#17
A lot of Eastern societies are shame-based cultures. That's probably why you feel you are not measuring up when all the evidence is pretty much the opposite.

When I say shame-based cultures, what I really mean is that there is usually an honor system in place so that things don't end awry. It's based on the idea that you don't want to bring shame to your family/city/country whathaveyou. In theory, it's a really good idea to model a society based on this... That is... if it wasn't for people constantly feeling shame about everything. I mean, sure, society functions perfectly fine... It's just that Japan tends to have one of the highest suicide rates in the world (I think). I know you are from the Philippines, but my point was that a lot of Eastern cultures have this problem.
We do have a shame culture too although not as hardcore as that of the Japanese. We do prefer running amok or suicide by cop as a "proper" means of committing suicide.

Would totally be cool if our politicians have a better sense of shame though :P
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
Local time
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Messages
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Philippines
#18
Hm. So right now you know that your life situation is not ideal. But at the same time you do not know what is your ideal situation. You are introducing variation to your career by learning programming with the possibility of reaching that unknown ideal situation. Am I getting close?
A bit close. My personal life situation is okay in society's standards but I think I can do better and I can become much happier. Programming is something that I am studying and enjoying, hopefully it can help me reach that happiness.
 

QuickTwist

Pawn who fights for injustice
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Different day, different place
#19
A lot of Eastern societies are shame-based cultures. That's probably why you feel you are not measuring up when all the evidence is pretty much the opposite.

When I say shame-based cultures, what I really mean is that there is usually an honor system in place so that things don't end awry. It's based on the idea that you don't want to bring shame to your family/city/country whathaveyou. In theory, it's a really good idea to model a society based on this... That is... if it wasn't for people constantly feeling shame about everything. I mean, sure, society functions perfectly fine... It's just that Japan tends to have one of the highest suicide rates in the world (I think). I know you are from the Philippines, but my point was that a lot of Eastern cultures have this problem.
We do have a shame culture too although not as hardcore as that of the Japanese. We do prefer running amok or suicide by cop as a "proper" means of committing suicide.

Would totally be cool if our politicians have a better sense of shame though :P
Ah, true enough, but it's more about the appearance of honor rather than honor itself IIRC. They don't actually care if they do such and such a bad thing as long as it isn't reflected as a shameful thing to do. Basically, get ahead by any means necessary, just don't get caught. Ofc, politics is pretty much always politics so I gather the nature of politics itself is mostly to blame for this anyways.
 
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