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How to get an insecure INTP to shut the fuck up????

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Bird

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Really.


What gives all of you assurance?
What does one have to do to prove their goddamn worth to you?
 

Lobstrich

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What are you talking about? Your thread is asking how to get insecure INTP's to shut up. And then you go on and ask us what gives us assurance? (In what? By the way) And I suppose if we are so insecure, you wouldn't have to prove your worth to us.

I don't know, I just think it's kind of contradicting.
 

Darby

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I'm super lost, are you the one who is insecure? or someone else? Also, to your title, I don't really know. For what gives us assurance, I'm also not really sure what specifically you're asking for. Last but not least, I don't know exactly what causes me to find worth in someone else, I just tell myself they are awesome, and then they either disappoint or don't...if that is what you are asking.
 

Hadoblado

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DO:
Be nice, concise, give food for thought, have defensible position on EVERY subject.

DON'T:
Raise your voice, dismiss ideas out of hand because you don't understand and/or care, alienate them in any way, question their competence, play up to get attention.

That said I'm not completely certain if you want one to shut up or to prove your worth. Personally I'm in the comfort zone when I'm allowed to ramble about my latest thoughts on things that my listener would not normally think about, but they show interest and understanding enough to have a position.
Whatever personality type you are, you sound like you would have this particular quality as you come on this forum of your own free will.

Take this in the nicest possible way, as it is just an observation with zero malicious intent. As you can see from the posts above mine, your manner in the title and OP do not gel well with us. You need clarity, and you need objectivity. Using emotive words and undefined terms only confuses or alienates the average INTP.

Best of luck in 'securing' your INTP :cool:
 

EyeSeeCold

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undefined terms only confuses or alienates the average INTP.
This makes sense.

I think we're so simple that we're actually complicated.
 

warryer

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By hearing them out. :rolleyes:
 

ProxyAmenRa

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I was hoping for someone to go on a long rant about an insecure INTP they know and how thisa INTP drives them insane. But no! Not happening!
 

Cavallier

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Yes, I guess examples are necessary.

Personally I just have a lot of questions. I don't understand the world but I want to so I ask a lot of questions. Then I question the answers I'm given. I had a friend (not a friend really in the end) who would get pissed off with my questions and thought I was being dense, argumentative, and generally pushy. She said I was insecure and I asked her why she thought that. The question pissed her off more. It was a train wreck. I was confused and couldn't give her what she wanted. I think most people are insecure. I'm certain I am about most things.

This is another trap isn't it?
 

MissQuote

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This makes sense.

I think we're so simple that we're actually complicated.
Your post just made me laugh, not out loud, you know the 'I'm laughing so hard in my head it would shock you' type of laughter.

Another thread here about the importance of logic (I think that might actually be the title of it) got me off on this tangent of ideas today about how good logic shows how most complicated situations are actually very simple when one examines them throughly enough and the other side of that coin being how the seemingly simple situations can actually be caused by high complexity.

I was going to make a thread about it with some analogies and actual observed behaviours I've made, but I ended up side tracked.

I might still write the thread.
 

jzono1

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How to get an insecure INTP to shut the fuck up????
State clearly to him how destructive his behavior is. Grab him by the balls, figuratively or literally and tell him that what he does hurts, and that it must stop. Be precise about how there's no point in being stuck in a poisonous loop that leads to no good. Deny him contact enough to leave room for the harsh reality to sink in. It isn't easy, and it takes a strong will, but it works.

What gives all of you assurance?
Cold logic.

What does one have to do to prove their goddamn worth to you?
Be honest. Even when the truth hurts the very roots of my soul. Show backbone, yet be cautious about using it.

Feed my feelings and I never get time to apply my cold logic.

---

Try to detach a bit from your feelings and look rationally at it. You should not have to prove your worth to anyone. Focus on yourself, don't let him get to you. Hurt him if that's what it takes.
 

pjoa09

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ok, i am not going to answer anymore questions.


from all you've said I think you want to feel approved here.

we never approve anyone here, (use an innovative gangstalicious swear word here).


And I doubt INTP all the way, I think of myself as a Love Shy, ADD, riddled aspie-IXTP with inbuilt LSD.
 

cheese

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Huh? Hurt someone just to shut them up? Can't you just....cease contact with them? :confused:

Also, Bird, it'd be worth making sure that he actually is INTP, or none of this will be of any help. (It might be useless anyway - putting trust in MBTI is a bit of a leap.)
 

jzono1

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Yes cheese. Sometimes just ceasing contact doesn't work. It isn't easy to cease contact with someone who doesn't want to accept that.

I've been there, a few years back. I understand the compulsion not to let go. It hurt when she did what I describe. Now that time has passed I see how it was good for us both. It still hurts though.

Don't misunderstand me. Deliberately hurting shouldn't be done lightly, but if nothing else helps then it's an option that can work.
 

Melkor

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Kill them.

INTP's have a natural state of 'impending failure'. Regardless of how well you do, you'll always fail.
One can only be so secure when taken to logic and the application of analytical thought.
I find secure people often overlook details...
 

crippli

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Why is there 4 question marks, and only 3 questions?
 

RobertJ

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I find secure people often overlook details...
Hmm, yes. Well put.

Bird, I can't help but think your situation is based in some personal matter with a particular INTP (the manner in which you presented your inquiry led me to this thought). And dammit, now I'm insecure. Who are you talking about?
 

CoryJames

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Could you repeat the question?
 

Bird

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DO:
Be nice, concise, give food for thought, have defensible position on EVERY subject.

DON'T:
Raise your voice, dismiss ideas out of hand because you don't understand and/or care, alienate them in any way, question their competence, play up to get attention.

That said I'm not completely certain if you want one to shut up or to prove your worth. Personally I'm in the comfort zone when I'm allowed to ramble about my latest thoughts on things that my listener would not normally think about, but they show interest and understanding enough to have a position.
Whatever personality type you are, you sound like you would have this particular quality as you come on this forum of your own free will.

Take this in the nicest possible way, as it is just an observation with zero malicious intent. As you can see from the posts above mine, your manner in the title and OP do not gel well with us. You need clarity, and you need objectivity. Using emotive words and undefined terms only confuses or alienates the average INTP.

Best of luck in 'securing' your INTP :cool:

I am a good friend and I have been for the last six years.
Which is why I find the behaviour ridiculous.
 

Bird

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Hmm, yes. Well put.

Bird, I can't help but think your situation is based in some personal matter with a particular INTP (the manner in which you presented your inquiry led me to this thought). And dammit, now I'm insecure. Who are you talking about?
My friend Jacob.


Omg Bird has friends.
Yeah.
 

Bird

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Huh? Hurt someone just to shut them up? Can't you just....cease contact with them? :confused:

Also, Bird, it'd be worth making sure that he actually is INTP, or none of this will be of any help. (It might be useless anyway - putting trust in MBTI is a bit of a leap.)

He is.
 

Yet

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:)

hey c'mon ... it could be not about you but about a general feeling of insecurity coming forth out of being misunderstood once too often in the past weeks ... than the tendency grows into questioning more things that are slightily related.
Communication is not one of our strongest points, I mean: to get info accross is the easiest bit, but without the (what a lot of people tend to see as) social clumsiness (being too straightforward and 'blunt') is the challenge.

He might have bumped his head a bit into a few walls, negative reactions and got insecure about all sorts of relationships & is in a sort of retreat or looks for a 'fight' with someone safe enough.

Hear him out, ask questions to get to the point & rationalise him into reason.

I might be totally wrong and interpreting this .. well I gave it a shot anyway :kilroy:
 

Zmaster

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No INTP can be secure because of the P! To perceive something is to look at it from alternative points of view. What makes us unique in a relatively sort of way is we are secure in our insecurity! Basically we have less Fear of the unknown so we can explore more of life. It's only when we attempt to communicate our thoughts externally which is not something we do well, that we dare to show how insecure we can be. Therefore the question should be why would you want to tell an INTP to shut up when its rare that you can even get us to talk in the first place?
 

JesusChrist

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No INTP can be secure because of the P! To perceive something is to look at it from alternative points of view. What makes us unique in a relatively sort of way is we are secure in our insecurity! Basically we have less Fear of the unknown so we can explore more of life. It's only when we attempt to communicate our thoughts externally which is not something we do well, that we dare to show how insecure we can be. Therefore the question should be why would you want to tell an INTP to shut up when its rare that you can even get us to talk in the first place?
This seems like the best response to me, considering the OP really hasn't let on with any information to base an opinion on. Makes me chuckle to consider that fact that someone comes asking for opinions from a bunch of analytical INTP personalities without giving them any background information or data to crunch on.

It's no wonder the OP and their friend are seemingly having issues. You're probably driving the poor guy mad, lol. More than likely he's sitting there wishing you would shut up with the trying to change him, trying to relay his feelings on the situation back to you, confused as to why you can't comprehend his opinion of the situation. Try taking some time to objectively consider what he is saying to you. :D

You wouldn't by some chance happen to be a female trying to "change" a male would you? What's your own personality type? You seem to have a lot of posts here. Seems funny that you'd have such a hard time understanding this person's thought process. Would seem to me that if you were both truly INTP you'd be able to connect on some level of understanding regarding the situation.
 

Bird

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This seems like the best response to me, considering the OP really hasn't let on with any information to base an opinion on. Makes me chuckle to consider that fact that someone comes asking for opinions from a bunch of analytical INTP personalities without giving them any background information or data to crunch on.

It's no wonder the OP and their friend are seemingly having issues. You're probably driving the poor guy mad, lol. More than likely he's sitting there wishing you would shut up with the trying to change him, trying to relay his feelings on the situation back to you, confused as to why you can't comprehend his opinion of the situation. Try taking some time to objectively consider what he is saying to you. :D

You wouldn't by some chance happen to be a female trying to "change" a male would you? What's your own personality type? You seem to have a lot of posts here. Seems funny that you'd have such a hard time understanding this person's thought process. Would seem to me that if you were both truly INTP you'd be able to connect on some level of understanding regarding the situation.

No. I am not the female type that tries to change others.



I try really hard not to set myself up for disappointment and trying to change someone is a sure way to ensure I will be disappointed. Ordinarily if I am tired of your bullshit, I walk away and that's the end of it.
I do not do that in this scenario because I know he is rather fond of me and as irritating as I find him from time to time I am fond of him as well.



I am not an INTP.


And I don't give you personal information because I am a very private girl and the background information spans five years.


Thank you for assuming that I am trying to change him.
I am only asking for him to respect me and the way that I am. He is the one that wants to change me. He wants me to bend over backwards for him and be his security blanket, his "crutch" and I do not have the qualifications to be this anchor in someone's life.

Now I am going to make myself upset thinking about this.
Jeez.



Also, nice tact. I enjoy how you first tell me I am trying to change him and then later in the post you ask me if I am.
Uhm hello, why bother to ask? You clearly have me all figured out (;
 

lafmeche

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This feels a bit like a giant troll, but I'll bite anyway.

I am not an INTP.
This is becoming more and more obvious.

And I don't give you personal information because I am a very private girl and the background information spans five years.
Understandable, but asking INTPs for advice without providing them with all the information just doesn't work. We deal in facts and theories, not your emotional rollercoaster world.

Thank you for assuming that I am trying to change him.
I am only asking for him to respect me and the way that I am.
He does or you wouldn't be his friend.

He is the one that wants to change me. He wants me to bend over backwards for him and be his security blanket, his "crutch" and I do not have the qualifications to be this anchor in someone's life.
You're projecting your own feelings onto him. There is no plan or intent in his mind to change you. INTPs question themselves much more than most types and it sometimes gets overwhelming. In those circumstances, an INTP will turn to his closest friends for support or completely withdraw from the world. In a way, you should be flattered that he's willing to turn to you.


It seems to me that one of the following things is happening:

  1. He's always turned to you for support and it's only recently started bothering you (or it's finally built up enough that you're tired of it).
  2. He's finally comfortable enough with you to start opening up. To borrow from Shrek: INTPs are like onions. Maybe you've finally gotten through a few layers.
  3. He's recently had some major source of stress added to his life and is looking for help coping with it, but you're too blinded by your own desire not to be bothered that you don't want to help.
INTPs see friends differently than most other types (I don't know you or your type, so take this however you like). For lack of a better way of saying it, the more common types prefer shallower relationships. They see friends as people to spend time with, whereas INTPs want to know everything they can about their friends.

You're being emotional. INTPs are not emotional about most things. Until you stop being emotional, you will not be capable of dealing with us effectively or understanding what is going on with your friend.
 

Bird

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This feels a bit like a giant troll, but I'll bite anyway.


This is becoming more and more obvious.

Understandable, but asking INTPs for advice without providing them with all the information just doesn't work. We deal in facts and theories, not your emotional rollercoaster world.

He does or you wouldn't be his friend.

You're projecting your own feelings onto him. There is no plan or intent in his mind to change you. INTPs question themselves much more than most types and it sometimes gets overwhelming. In those circumstances, an INTP will turn to his closest friends for support or completely withdraw from the world. In a way, you should be flattered that he's willing to turn to you.


It seems to me that one of the following things is happening:

  1. He's always turned to you for support and it's only recently started bothering you (or it's finally built up enough that you're tired of it).
  2. He's finally comfortable enough with you to start opening up. To borrow from Shrek: INTPs are like onions. Maybe you've finally gotten through a few layers.
  3. He's recently had some major source of stress added to his life and is looking for help coping with it, but you're too blinded by your own desire not to be bothered that you don't want to help.
INTPs see friends differently than most other types (I don't know you or your type, so take this however you like). For lack of a better way of saying it, the more common types prefer shallower relationships. They see friends as people to spend time with, whereas INTPs want to know everything they can about their friends.

You're being emotional. INTPs are not emotional about most things. Until you stop being emotional, you will not be capable of dealing with us effectively or understanding what is going on with your friend.

No, I am not.


And yes, there is intent to change me.

He wants our relationship to become more intimate, for me to give him the majority of my time and for me to share every little thing with him.

If I spend time with others he gets incredibly panicky and gets rather upset telling me that I don't care about him, etc... etc...
Which is bullshit because if I didn't care about him I would not make time for him at all let alone would I listen to his insecurities and try to soothe them.

For a couple of years he has been trying to get our relationship to deepen, to get me to become his "partner" for lack of better word.
He was the first and only person my best friend ever loved and no matter how I many times I try to explain this to him he does not comprehend. I do not want more from him and he is not satisfied with what we have now.
I don't know what to do. I value him as a friend but I cannot deal with the stress that this causes me.




Thank you for telling me that I will not understand what is going on with my friend. Thank you for telling me about myself. I know you have great insight into both my friend's life and mine. Oh omnipotent being thou art!


It is not that he is finally comfortable opening up to me, he's been comfortable doing this for quite some time. It is that he doesn't respect me or my feelings and is always demanding more. Making everything I offer or present to the table to be inferior and not good enough.


He's recently had some major stress?
That must be some mother fucking major stress to last years.


You are right. I am too selfish. I should do everything he wants. Who cares about me or my happiness or what I want? I need to be less selfish. I need to quit focusing on myself. I do not deserve to be treated well, to be respected. I am an abominable piece of female flesh that needs to bend over backwards and suck dick and do what everyone else wants of me.
 

Don't mind me

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Thank you for telling me that I will not understand what is going on with my friend. Thank you for telling me about myself. I know you have great insight into both my friend's life and mine. Oh omnipotent being thou art!
You make a thread with virtually no information asking for advice on an issue, and whenever anyone fills in the major gaps in the information you've provided with some assumptions to enable them to make any sense at all of the situation and, you know, advise you, you get mad? I'm not really sure why you made this thread :P
 

Bird

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You make a thread with virtually no information asking for advice on an issue, and whenever anyone fills in the major gaps in the information you've provided with some assumptions to enable them to make any sense at all of the situation and, you know, advise you, you get mad? I'm not really sure why you made this thread :P


Lol, I am not mad. You must be an INTP, misinterpreting feelings :P
 

shoeless

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he doesn't sound like much of an INTP based on that information. to me at least. i only think that because he sounds quite a lot like me in some ways, and i am certainly not an INTP (maybe INFJ maybe ENFP maybe ENTP i don't quite know but i don't think it matters much).

it sounds to me like he has attachment issues that go deeper than personality type. you have to tell him exactly how you feel, get him to see things from your perspective, because frankly, if you really don't want that stress, all you can do is distance yourself from him. it might hurt but it has to be done, if he's that insecure and wants a relationship and your'e just not into that if you keep placating him or whatever you're doing he's just going to grow more and more attached. you have to tell him straight up what he's doing to you, and how you want things to be. tell him you care about him and you want to help him but frankly there's only so much you can do and only so far you can go.

worst comes to worst, you might lose a friend. if it's causing you that much stress, sometimes it just has to happen. or just become less close than you were. i have literally dealt with almost the exact same thing you're describing and that's the honest truth of it.
 

IfloatTHRUlife

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Lol i come back after all this time and this is the stuff i see on this forum.. Sad

If you want your problems solved with an INTP, complaining to other INTPs wont really help you much, have you even honestly opened up to him? Many people have said this already but we are pretty oblivious people, if you are just shrugging off his advances without giving him a clearly defined NO, he will misinterpret your actions and just assume that he hasnt tried hard enough to win your love, hence his continual efforts.

Personally i find myself to have a nearly compulsive need to analyze peoples thoughts, and the compulsion is amplified when someone is not up front with me and i am left to make assumptions. The lesson you should gain from this, dont let crazy ass INTPs make assumptions.

And i am sure nobody appreciates your sarcasm, they were just trying to help. I could call you an idiot, but i wish to be nice seeing as how i have not been around lately.

Good Day Ma'am :D
 

Bird

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Please close this thread.


I am done.


Fuck it.
 

Lobstrich

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No, I am not.
Saying this, that you are not being emotional.

Thank you for telling me that I will not understand what is going on with my friend. Thank you for telling me about myself. I know you have great insight into both my friend's life and mine. Oh omnipotent being thou art!


It is not that he is finally comfortable opening up to me, he's been comfortable doing this for quite some time. It is that he doesn't respect me or my feelings and is always demanding more. Making everything I offer or present to the table to be inferior and not good enough.


He's recently had some major stress?
That must be some mother fucking major stress to last years.


You are right. I am too selfish. I should do everything he wants. Who cares about me or my happiness or what I want? I need to be less selfish. I need to quit focusing on myself. I do not deserve to be treated well, to be respected. I am an abominable piece of female flesh that needs to bend over backwards and suck dick and do what everyone else wants of me.
And then turning to say this, to a person who's only making an observation, telling you what he thinks. It is rather contradicting is is not?. I'd even say it's rather disrespectful. There is no need to take anything of what he said so personal.
 

Bird

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Saying this, that you are not being emotional.



And then turning to say this, to a person who's only making an observation, telling you what he thinks. It is rather contradicting is is not?. I'd even say it's rather disrespectful. There is no need to take anything of what he said so personal.


I was not saying I wasn't being emotional.
I am perfectly aware I have emotions and that
I am an emotional being (:


I was saying I was not trying to change him.
 
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