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How to escape passivity?

AW10

Redshirt
Joined
Jun 16, 2013
Messages
2
#1
Hello, I came to this forum, hoping I can get some help. Thing I explained here may be shown more dramatically than usual, beacause of my condition at the moment I was writing it.

I am currently 18 and half years old and as time goes I am becoming more and more passive that I just can't find a way to escape it. All the things I do all days are playing on computer, making theories, eating, drinking and sleeping. Most of my lastest theories is about escaping that routine. They rarely work, if I even give them a try.

That condition sometimes makes my Choleric activate. Unfortunately, it got shuted down as soon as it got activated. However, all the great things I accomplish lately in my life were when he was active.

Some people would definetly explain my condition as depression, but I refuese to see it as it. I have just distanced my mind from everything, including myself. I am more like some plant that can see. or maybe more like a some machine.

When I am not doing anything from above, I just day dream about how I would be free from this passivity one day and use sensing to clear my thoughts while also walking aimlessly.

Only excitement I currently have is few minutes of happiness that occur when I just finish some new theory. But, as soon as happiness went away the paper on which I wrote the theory get lost in constantly messy room.

Now, when summer came I can go out in nature, but I can't even enjoy it anymore. I waste all my time I spend outside analyzing everything that could be analyzed, especially women.

I have been going to psychiatrist, but I have decided to throw it away since it is pointless. He is just telling what skills I suppose to get, not how to use those that I already have. btw. What I have according to them is Asperger syndrome, but it took me year to even got truly interested in it.

I am not asking for a miracle, I just want to find something I could enjoy doing in my life. I curently can't find anything.
 

Architect

Professional INTP
Joined
Dec 25, 2010
Messages
6,692
#2
All the things I do all days are playing on computer, making theories, eating, drinking and sleeping.
And the problem is? Do you not like playing on the computer and making theories? If you don't like doing it, then why are you doing it? I suspect rather you feel the need to do something more normal and standard, like work a 9-5 job. Are you feeling societal pressure to be somebody different, or is this really coming from you?

That condition sometimes makes my Choleric activate. Unfortunately, it got shuted down as soon as it got activated. However, all the great things I accomplish lately in my life were when he was active.
I have no idea what you said here.

Only excitement I currently have is few minutes of happiness that occur when I just finish some new theory. But, as soon as happiness went away the paper on which I wrote the theory get lost in constantly messy room.

Now, when summer came I can go out in nature, but I can't even enjoy it anymore. I waste all my time I spend outside analyzing everything that could be analyzed, especially women.
OK, so you really like analyzing things.

I just want to find something I could enjoy doing in my life. I curently can't find anything.
You need to reformulate the problem. Obviously you like analyzing things, and it's not clear what you want. Something else to analyze? Or do you want to stop analyzing? Or do you want a job where you analyze things?
 

DIALECTIC

Active Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2012
Messages
281
#3
How to escape passivity?
You escape passivity in putting yourself in a situation in which you have no other choice than being active (if you want to prevail) !

How old are you ? Your life probably doesn't have enough stress / spice for you to stimulate you into acting and unleashing your hidden / untapped potential...

Best piece of advice i can give yoy is (if you are young enough) to pick a country (with a different language) and move there ! I can assure you it will develop all your functions and bring spice in your life... I did it when i was 18 (i moved to the USA and live there 1 year), and again when i was 22 (i moved to the UK and been living there ever since; i am 39... And now i am bored again and want to go elsewhere !).

If you stay in the same environment, especially if it doesn't stimulate your intellect enough, you will suffer !!! I found the best way to learn is to be around a different / another culture, this way you can be taught their way of seeing/doing things and you can teach them yours. There is always an opportunity for a foreigner to seize and take advantage of the situation...
With time, the stress of such a new life will bring out the best in you.

As INTPs if there is no stress in our life we remain P which is boring... But as soon as stress comes up we then automatically go into "J" mode, that's where the real fun is especially as we get better at it. However the danger is when the stress becomes chronic and we are not able to go back to our natural "P"ness and we start believing we are "J" therefore we act like over the top J's with potentially catastrophic results !
 

Architect

Professional INTP
Joined
Dec 25, 2010
Messages
6,692
#4
As INTPs if there is no stress in our life we remain P... But as soon as stress comes up we automatically go into "J" mode, that's where the real fun is especially as we get better at it. However the danger is when the stress becomes chronic and we are not able to go back to our natural "P"ness...
No we are inner judgers (Ti) and outwards perceives (Ne), which is why we are labeled P, because that is what we extrovert. Making theories is a highly judging function.

I agree however that a little bit stress and accountability is generally a good thing for an INTP.
 

DIALECTIC

Active Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2012
Messages
281
#5
No we are inner judgers (Ti) and outwards perceives (Ne), which is why we are labeled P, because that is what we extrovert. Making theories is a highly judging function.
What i mean is stress, especially chronic stress, will unleash our shadow type.
For example under very heavy stress (work related) when i was younger i behaved a lot more like an ESFJ than an INTP ! That's how i met / got along so good with my ESFJ girlfriend. Then, something happened (the stress factor stopped) and i switched back to INTP mode. Now my girlfriend and i have absolutely nothing in common anymore !
 

Architect

Professional INTP
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6,692
#6

RaBind

sparta? THIS IS MADNESS!!!
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#7
Seems like you just want to stop analyzing so much and want to use your Se much more often. I don't wanna got spiritual go you, as I myself am not spiritual, but maybe try mindfulness, if you really want to use your Se instead of your Te.
basically
Mindfulness, which, among other things, is an attentive awareness of the reality of things (especially of the present moment) is an antidote to delusion and is considered as such a 'power' (Pali: bala). This faculty becomes a power in particular when it is coupled with clear comprehension of whatever is taking place.

Psychiatrist? my dad used to tell me that he would take me to the psychiatrist for, what I now know is, my Fe bursting out in stressful situations. I think avoiding the psychiatrist, if you can, is a good choice. "I am what I think you think I am" - Cooley. Self labeling I think can be harmful, especially if you feel like the labeling is not within your control. As well as psychiatrists being expensive.
 

DIALECTIC

Active Member
Joined
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Messages
281
#8
No we are inner judgers (Ti) and outwards perceives (Ne).
The ESFJ shadow type of the INTP would therefore be outter judger (Fe) and would inwardly perceive...
Well, i used to be a drama queen, a big spender (i used to spend all the money the INTP part of me had worked hard for and saved up) and have arguments (for nothing or maybe the "fun of it") with people for many many years... Sounds like unbounded outter judging (Fe)...?

Also from about age 28 until age 36 i used to have panic attacks and anxiety every day as i was hypocondriac (i ended up at hospital countless times just to be told in the end i was alright)... Sounds like unbounded inner perceiving (Si)...?
 

AW10

Redshirt
Joined
Jun 16, 2013
Messages
2
#9
Seems like you just want to stop analyzing so much and want to use your Se much more often. I don't wanna got spiritual go you, as I myself am not spiritual, but maybe try mindfulness, if you really want to use your Se instead of your Te.
While trying to answer questions Architect asked me, especially this: "Are you feeling societal pressure to be somebody different, or is this really coming from you?", something was triggered in me. Well, pressure from my parents and friends was obvious, but I suddenly asked myself, could this be that the same spiritual book that literally changed me from inside out, now pressure me to be somebody different than what I really want to be.

It was true. Ever since I read "Awareness" by Anthony de Mello, I felt a huge change happened to me, and everyone noticed it. However, it went terribly wrong. On unconscious level, I got a belief that if I don't keep the same path I may not experience the happines I experienced 6 mounths ago, when I have finished the book. That forced me to alter my own path with Mello's. I started to fall apart and I couldn't realise why. Everyone, including me, soon noticed I went downhill. Now, I fianally understand what lead me to this: I have become a prisoner of a thing that helped me.

Me: "That condition sometimes makes my Choleric activate. Unfortunately, it got shuted down as soon as it got activated. However, all the great things I accomplish lately in my life were when he was active."

I have no idea what you said here.
You escape passivity in putting yourself in a situation in which you have no other choice than being active (if you want to prevail) !

How old are you ? Your life probably doesn't have enough stress / spice for you to stimulate you into acting and unleashing your hidden / untapped potential... .
As a backgound to this, during my last six months I was finishing high school and the most important decisions of my life are needed to be made. The thing I explained above caused me to stop studying at all. However, as soon I got to the point when where I must pull myself together if I ever plan to finish school, my Choleric (INTP = PhlegChlor) took over and gave me energy to do things I never thought are possible. I managed to escape the situation I brought myself into and finish the high school.

P.S.: According to what I have just wrote, Dialectic's theory really seems to be standing.

The ESFJ shadow type of the INTP would therefore be outter judger (Fe) and would inwardly perceive...
What does shadow type stand for?
 
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#10
As a backgound to this, during my last six months I was finishing high school and the most important decisions of my life are needed to be made. The thing I explained above caused me to stop studying at all. However, as soon I got to the point when where I must pull myself together if I ever plan to finish school, my Choleric (INTP = PhlegChlor) took over and gave me energy to do things I never thought are possible. I managed to escape the situation I brought myself into and finish the high school.

Something tells me you'll be feeling the same push-pull over and over again your whole life.

I know I do. I have no advice.

Tell more about PhlegChlor. Is that a name you have devised for a portion of your personality or is it a description of your internal state? I think you mean Phlegmatic and Choleric, but you say INTP=PhlegChlor I want to know what that means.
 

RaBind

sparta? THIS IS MADNESS!!!
Joined
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#11
Tell more about PhlegChlor. Is that a name you have devised for a portion of your personality or is it a description of your internal state? I think you mean Phlegmatic and Choleric, but you say INTP=PhlegChlor I want to know what that means.
Google is the best solution to virtually every problem you'll come across.

PhlegChlor
The PhlegChlor


The most active of all phlegmatics is the PhlegChlor. But it must be remembered that since he is predominantly a phlegmatic, he will never be a ball of fire. Like his brother phlegmatics, he is easy to get along with and may become an excellent group leader. The phlegmatic has the potential to become a good counselor, for he is an excellent listener, does not interrupt the client with stories about himself, and is genuinely interested in other people. Although the PhlegChlor rarely offers his services to others, when they come to his organized office where he exercises control, he is a first-rate professional. His advice will be practical, helpful, and - if he is a Bible-taught Christian - quite trustworthy. His gentle spirit never makes people feel threatened. He always does the right thing, rarely goes beyond the norm. If his wife can make the adjustment to his passive life-style and reluctance to take the lead in the home, particularly in the discipline of their children, they can enjoy a happy marriage.

The weaknesses of the PhlegChlor are not readily apparent but gradually come to the surface, especially in the home. In addition to the lack of motivation and the fear problems of the other phlegmatics, he can be determinedly stubborn and unyielding. He doesn't blow up at others, but simply refuses to give in or cooperate. He is not a fighter by nature, but often lets his inner anger and stubbornness reflect itself in silence. The PhlegChlor often retreats to his "workshop" alone or nightly immerses his mind in TV. The older he gets, the more he selfishly indulges his sedentary tendency and becomes increasingly passive. Although he will probably live a long and peaceful life, if he indulges these passive feelings it is a boring life - not only for him, but also for his family. He needs to give himself to the concerns and needs of his family.

No man in the Bible epitomizes the PhlegChlor better than Abraham in the Old Testament. Fear characterized everything he did in the early days. For instance, he was reluctant to leave the security of the pagan city of Ur when God first called him; he even denied his wife on two occasions and tried to palm her off as his sister because of fear. Finally, he surrendered completely to God and grew in the spirit. Accordingly, his greatest weakness became his greatest strength. Today, instead of being known as fearful Abraham, he has the reputation of being the man who "believed in the Lord; and he counted it unto him for righteousness."

- See more at: http://www.goingthedistance.org/pages.asp?pageid=18155#sthash.urDQqKeP.dpuf
 
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#12
Do you have any interests that you could use a springboard for getting some good socialization? You could join a book club or something along the lines. Else a simple part time job works wonders for getting you to appreciate your free time just that much more.

Also if your passivity bothers you so much that you spend a lot of time mulling it over, then you really should do something about it. You may or may not be depressed now, but the state you are describing (granted your discomfort with it) sounds like a predecessor to a real depression if it isn't one already. How long have you been "passive" to the point that it had bothered you and made you think of yourself as powerless and unable to escape your own passivity? If it's been going on for some time you really should consider getting a second opinion from someone IRL.

Also I'd say get another psychiatrist/therapist/coach, even if you are 100% not depressed, just describing your problems to someone else that's close enough for eye contact tends to be very relieving, humans are that simple. It's also good to go see someone who hasn't met you before, because they wont have preconceptions, they'll look at you with fresh eyes, also they are professionals unlike friends and relatives :) Your current one seems to be taking the wrong approach though, you get "skills" by going out and doing stuff, ie that's the only thing you needed to focus on, the rest follows naturally. But if you can't go see a therapist, then I really advice you to let someone close in on the deal.. heck ASK them to help you, tell them that you don't think you can do it on your own!

Finally, remember that you will probably always be passive compared to most people (your an INTP or some other IN type right?), and don't refrain from going out just because you analyze anyway. You're still subconsciously feeding that Ne, and besides do you really analyze the same things when you're outside that you do at home?
 

DIALECTIC

Active Member
Joined
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Messages
281
#13
I started to fall apart and I couldn't realise why. Everyone, including me, soon noticed I went downhill. Now, I fianally understand what lead me to this: I have become a prisoner of a thing that helped me.
I think the same thing pretty much happened to me after reading Nietzsche but especially Hegel for months and getting obsessed with then ! My words at the time were similar to yours: "i became trapped by my own logic" (in fact it was Hegel's logic i had been so much inspired with).

Maybe reading the book you mentionned has started shattering your persona, therefore you are scared of what is behind that mask of yours as it would mean either facing your shadow (and neither you or your current environment are ready for it especially since you are too young !) or creating a new persona to hide your shadow behind...?


What does shadow type stand for?
The shadow type is your negative twin... The type you could have been but never were. When chronic stress ("depression") activates it, you switch from a rational intuitive to an emotional sensor type...
So you start thinking what you feel (instead of feeling what you think) and you start intuiting what you sense (instead of sensing what you intuit). It's like trying to find your way on your personal existencial map (and the younger you are, the least accurate your existencial map will be) with a compass showing South as North without you knowing poles have been inversed !

Your type (when life is great): INTP - Ti Ne Si Fe.

Your shadow type (when life gets too stressful): ESFJ - Fe Si Ne Ti.

And theres the "God mode / type" too (when ideal opportunity meets ideal preparation): ENTJ - Te Ni Se Fi. I found this type artificially activates through caffeine and recreational drugs, however since it's like a "high", the crash that surely comes when you run out of psychic power is totally dreadul !
 

DIALECTIC

Active Member
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#14
Something tells me you'll be feeling the same push-pull over and over again your whole life.
I know I do. I have no advice.
I think the only way is A-to find an individual purpose and B-to find an universal purpose (for others).

I think (A) is a good start: "If you have nothing at all to create, then perhaps you create yourself." CARL JUNG

At 39 i pretty much finished with the largest part of (A), however i am still looking for (B) though ha !
 

Vrecknidj

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#15
...
I am currently 18 and half years old ...

I am not asking for a miracle, I just want to find something I could enjoy doing in my life. I curently can't find anything.
This isn't what you're looking for, I think, but here's my advice: wait.

You've had memories for something like 16 years or so. You've been a child for almost all of that time. Of your entire life so far, you have more practice at being a child than at being an adult. With any luck, you'll be an adult for another 80 years and you have virtually no experience of what that's going to be like.

In 7 years or so, you will have a pretty good idea of the very beginnings of what it's like to be an adult. In maybe 15 years you'll have sorted out some things and you'll have some motivations.

After that, you won't need our advice on such things.

So, back to my first bit of advice: wait.
 

Pyropyro

Magos Biologis
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#16
You escape passivity in putting yourself in a situation in which you have no other choice than being active (if you want to prevail) !
This.

You're still young, you can do lots of things :)
 

UfarkTheRipe

Insectile Projectile
Joined
Mar 15, 2013
Messages
130
#17
I am not asking for a miracle, I just want to find something I could enjoy doing in my life. I curently can't find anything.
Go find it and stop making excuses. I hereby bless you with this:

You can do it! And it's ok to make mistakes. Go make some!
 

DIALECTIC

Active Member
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Messages
281
#18
Go find it and stop making excuses. I hereby bless you with this:
You can do it! And it's ok to make mistakes. Go make some!
I do think we (INTPs) learn much better from our suffering / mistakes ("the negative") as they mobilize us to go forward, than from our successes ("the so called "positive") as they make us become complacent, big headed and full of ourselves, and quite frankly that's when we tend to stagnate or regress to earlier stages of our personal evolution... Until we realize it's been a mistake all along that is, then once again we are mobilized to go forward... "We have to regress to progress."
 

UfarkTheRipe

Insectile Projectile
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Messages
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#19
I think his analyzing himself into ambivalence is lulling him into inaction while making him think he's actually doing something useful- maybe caused by a hypercritical authority figure?

Confidence comes from success and you gotta do stuff to have that success. Failures, mistakes, bad luck, lack of wisdom are all part that process.

Feel free to say, "I suck, but I'm learning." and one day you'll be able to say, "Hey, I know what I'm talking about, beotch!"
 
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