# Drinking?>

#### Agent Intellect

##### Absurd Anti-hero.
anyone esle here drink a lot? i dunno if its INTP thing, but i cane ber kind of an alclholic, and i'm kind of drunk right now. anyone else?

#### OrionzRevenge

##### Member
IMO, our tendency to be isolated and overly circumspect of others lends itself to the potential for alcohol abuse.
Nothing like a wee bit of the Barley, or Grape, or even Cacti to bring out the Extrovert. So too, it can be used as a suave to assuage our anger at social and political slights.
Maybe you ought to do a poll Agent I????

Having said all that… CHEERS! *a hissing sound is heard as vapors of CO2 and yeast fermentation fill the air*

#### Vrecknidj

##### Prolific Member
My wife is almost insanely allergic to corn, wheat and soy.

Thank goodness for potato vodka!

But, seriously. I don't drink much because I don't have the time or money, and because I prefer to maintain an illusion of self control.

Dave

#### Ermine

##### is watching and taking notes
I'm almost obsessed with being in control of myself at all times, I'm underage, my religion prohibits alcohol, I don't want to deal with the health issues that come with it, I have every reason to not drink.

#### OrionzRevenge

##### Member
My wife is almost insanely allergic to corn, wheat and soy.

Thank goodness for potato vodka!

But, seriously. I don't drink much because I don't have the time or money, and because I prefer to maintain an illusion of self control.

Dave
I'm almost obsessed with being in control of myself at all times, I'm underage, my religion prohibits alcohol, I don't want to deal with the health issues that come with it, I have every reason to not drink.
I applaude both points of view. especially for our younger INTPs. This is one Tiger INTPs should be wary of.

#### Decaf

##### Professional Amateur
I haven't had a problem with it, but statistically speaking INTPs represent the biggest slice of the substance abuse pie when adjusted for the population of each type. I can find the research if you're interested.

#### OrionzRevenge

##### Member
I haven't had a problem with it, but statistically speaking INTPs represent the biggest slice of the substance abuse pie when adjusted for the population of each type. I can find the research if you're interested.
Go for it Coffee-lite!!!

#### Decaf

##### Professional Amateur
oops. I spoke before I knew whether or not I could produce. Its a paper by Naomi Quenk from 1996 buts its not available online that I can tell. I found reference to the research results in the 3rd Ed MBTI Manual.

#### Waterstiller

##### ... runs deep
I used to need a drink at least once a night to help me relax (age 18-22). Often, though, I'd have more than a few shots worth a night. But nobody could ever tell; no-matter how drunk I would get.

I've been averse to alcohol ever since switching to estrogen. I will get nauseated after more than one beer or even with a full alcoholic drink, no matter how much water I drink. The headaches and neck-aches, which were major reasons why I would drink, stopped at the same time.

#### OrionzRevenge

##### Member
oops. I spoke before I knew whether or not I could produce. Its a paper by Naomi Quenk from 1996 buts its not available online that I can tell. I found reference to the research results in the 3rd Ed MBTI Manual.
S'Ok, my java Jovial Friend. INTPs are smart cookies. We know this is a Type specific concern.

#### IntenseBurger

##### Active Member
I've never been drunk in my life
not a morals thing, I just don't want to lose control of myself

#### zxc

##### The Most Excellent Dave
I've never been drunk in my life
not a morals thing, I just don't want to lose control of myself
^ And also I don't like the taste of sips that I've had.

#### Kuu

I used to drink a lot more when I was 15. I used to feel so numb about stuff, and so bored even with my "friends", that just before going out to anywhere I secretly drank some shots of vodka or whatever hard liquor I could find at my house, which usually tasted like shit but I just wanted to "extravert" and drown the over-analyzing voice in my head... that was truly the only way that I could have any fun at all. I felt so inadequate, I wanted to negate myself and become an uncontrollable animal of pure feeling.

That was a time of much confusion and loneliness...

And then when I was a college freshman a couple of years ago... Most of my old friends had gone away to other universities. And the couple of new friends I started to hang out with liked to drink and go clubbing a lot, but they didn't get me at all, so I felt like shit even I was with them. Conclusion: I got totally wasted pretty constantly that year. Eventually I got sick of them... and vomiting, hangovers, waking up on the floor of strange rooms, and "cama loca" (vertigo... when you lay in bed and you feel like everything is spinning and you try to hang on to the bed to stop it, but it lasts for hours!! the most horrible sensation I've ever had in my life, for sure)

Now I'm much more wary of my alcohol consumption. The temptation to forget everything and loose control is sometimes so terribly seductive... I know I am capable of a lot of self-harm and self-deceit. I rarely drink heavily now, just some minor softer drinks, usually with food (today I had a couple of glasses of wine with my lasagna ) or calm friend gatherings, though even then I beware when one of my exes is around (its almost guaranteed that the extroverting feelings become a total train-wreck in that case ).

#### fullerene

##### Prolific Member
I was scared away from drinking the first time I did it. I have friends at college who don't drink (ie all of them), so it wasn't even a problem there, but over the summer all the people I knew from home did drink, so I did when I hung out with them. I think I had like 5-6 (think) and I'm very light, 140 lbs and no tolerance for alcohol built up yet or anything.

problem 1: There were two brands there and I only wanted to try them both, so I drank like triple what I thought I would
problem 2: I felt a little sick even during the drunken part... as I remember what I was thinking during the drinking, it was "this doesn't feel that good at all."
problem 3: The next night, after it was all out of my system and I was just sitting around at home, I found myself wondering when the next party would be, because I wanted to see if there would be the same problem if I only had one or two--and the sick feeling from #2 was replaced by "it wasn't all that bad... actually it was a little numbing/unique, and kinda cool because of how different it was."

#3 is very strongly attached to other events in my life in my mind... actually that whole series is--when you find yourself attracted to something that makes you sick, you're in for a rough time if you don't run away immediately. So that scared me off quite a bit. I don't think I'll ever drink again... I just don't trust myself to handle it.

#### Decaf

##### Professional Amateur
My mom instilled in me a sense that drinking socially wasn't a bad thing early on. I, alone of my siblings, didn't drink more than a sip until after I turned 21. After that I found some kinds of alcohol that I like, though I can't stand the taste of beer and find it confusing that others would. Then again, I like tequila, so who am I to talk?

I was scared of getting drunk too, not wanting to lose control, not wanting to vomit or fall down and hurt myself. Sensible concerns (do you ever find that we resist doing a lot of things other people love because of sensible concerns like that?).

As I was graduating from college I threw a big party, got a half keg of nice beer and invited all my friends. It was at a friend's house so I felt completely secure that I could get drunk and still be taken care of and I was curious of the experience. I figured knowing my limit in drinking was a valuable piece of self-knowledge (like my desire to find out how I would fare in a fight).

I had been drinking tequila somewhat regularly (a couple shots on the weekends... not alcoholic, but not a good pattern) so I decided to push it. I ended up taking 11 shots in an hour and a half. Now that sounds like an awful lot and a big risk, but I was paying close attention to my body while I was still sober trying to calculate how much was the right amount (even at a party I can't not be a scientist) and I was just about dead on. I got drunk, swaying, slurring, having to deliberately take steps to make sure I didn't fall. I ended up over the toilet for a minute or two, not didn't throw up, then sat on the couch for a few minutes but didn't pass out. All in all, it was the ideal drinking experience. I intentionally stayed up till I started feeling it leave my system to avoid the hangover (lots of water intake helps).

OK, so that was how to do it to learn about yourself in a relatively productive way. If you search for me and ninja costume you'll see the story of how to do it the wrong way, and since that time I'm never getting drunk again. I came, I learned, I survived... check, done.

#### Death

##### ..still alive
I'm a teetotaller all my life,I just don't like the taste of beer,it tastes weird.

#### Fleur

##### Prolific Member
Me cant speak. Mes still underage.

First: I dont drink because I cant handle alchocol well. I have hangover even if drink one glass.

Second: I like to rebel against unwritten rules of teenagers - actually, its even more fun than rebelling against adults.

Third: I dont like the taste either.

#### eudemonia

##### still searching
I can't believe what I've read so far. I think the UK has a real drinking culture. When I went to university I drank a hell of a lot - actually to keep up with the men half the time. Once, I got so drunk that I tried to cycle home, fell over and lost half my front tooth. But, onwards and upwards.

Alcohol is the drug of choice here - we all do it. We wouldn't think of going out and not having a couple of drinks at least. Usually, I'm with friends,we're chatting, the wine is flowing, we're having a great time and, what do you know, the room is spinning. I can give it up for Lent and try not to drink a glass of wine during the week but even that goes by the wayside if I'm going out. Even in our home groups - bible study - the wine flows freely and we have a great time.

I find I can't take half as much as I could when I was younger - 'thank God,' my liver is telling me.

#### NoID10ts

##### aka Noddy
I can't believe what I've read so far. I think the UK has a real drinking culture. When I went to university I drank a hell of a lot - actually to keep up with the men half the time. Once, I got so drunk that I tried to cycle home, fell over and lost half my front tooth. But, onwards and upwards.

Alcohol is the drug of choice here - we all do it. We wouldn't think of going out and not having a couple of drinks at least. Usually, I'm with friends,we're chatting, the wine is flowing, we're having a great time and, what do you know, the room is spinning. I can give it up for Lent and try not to drink a glass of wine during the week but even that goes by the wayside if I'm going out. Even in our home groups - bible study - the wine flows freely and we have a great time.

I find I can't take half as much as I could when I was younger - 'thank God,' my liver is telling me.

It's funny how different things are in different parts of the world. I live in the so called "Bible belt" in the US where drinking alchohol (any type, any capacity) is literally considered a sin by most protestant Christians. I am noticing that that trend is changing a bit and drinking in moderation is becoming slightly more acceptable, but not much. As far as I know, the US is one of the only places where alchohol has that kind of stigma among the Christian community.

#### fullerene

##### Prolific Member
[FONT=Arial, Arial, Helvetica]Jews don't recognize Jesus as the Son of God.
Protestants don't recognize the pope as the Ruler of the Church.
Baptists don't recognize each other in a liquor store.

[/FONT]

#### Agent Intellect

##### Absurd Anti-hero.
I don't even remember making this thread.

anyway, i don't understand the not wanting to lose control of oneself. one of the reasons i do drink, i think, is because i like to feel other then myself for a time. its the reason i used to take pain killers in high school (mostly vicodin and codeine). it helps quiet the omnipresent voice in my head.

#### Artifice Orisit

##### Guest
My parents had a unique way of introducing me to alcohol; they offered it to me long before I developed such tastes. They'd let me try something and of course I wouldn't like it; this tactic was repeated every couple of years or so. Now that I'm eighteen (legal drinking age) I like alcohol but I've also been conditioned into avoiding it; so I drink, but I have no will to drink to excess.

Furthermore for the past couple of years they've been letting me drink in controlled amounts; which is ingenious because now I have a surprising tolerance for the stuff. For the sake of sheer curiosity I've tried to become drunk; an expensive and fruitless experiment. I've never been able to make myself drunk and I've never had the will to do so, in summary I recommend giving controlled amounts of alcohol to minors.

That one time I tried to get drunk all that happened was that I became happy sociable and promptly fell asleep.

#### Agent Intellect

##### Absurd Anti-hero.
to me, alcohol is liquid courage. its like drinking turns me into my Tyler Durden (fight club reference), lowering my introverted and thinking functions so that i speak first and think later (usually the next morning). i feel like i'm more "powerful" when i'm drunk, like i can just say or do anything without consequence, which is nice (in a way) because when sober, i can't help but think of the hundred negative things a certain action might bring, which makes me feel less depressed. of course, then i do stupid shit (like make dumb posts on a certain forum) that i later regret. then i drink and forget about those regrets and the cycle starts all over again.

#### Jesin

##### Prolific Member
That approach actually sounds potentially good. Give them smallish amounts every once in a while, and by the time they're of legal drinking age, the novelty of it will be mostly gone.

It would need to be done carefully in order to avoid causing an addiction, though.

#### Agent Intellect

##### Absurd Anti-hero.
That approach actually sounds potentially good. Give them smallish amounts every once in a while, and by the time they're of legal drinking age, the novelty of it will be mostly gone.

It would need to be done carefully in order to avoid causing an addiction, though.

i don't know. i started drinking when i was 15 years old. back then it was a social thing, i did it when i got together with a few people on the weekends. when i turned 21 (legal age in US) is when it became more of a problem, mainly because i could buy it myself, not needing to get someone else to buy it for me. only in the past 5~ months has it become a huge problem (after i moved out), now i drink to some extent pretty much every night (i've had a little tonight, but fortunately not as much as last night).

#### Devercia

##### Deleterious Defenistrator
Mostly a teetotaler. I don't like the taste of almost any liquor. The ones I can stand are only 1 servings worth before it tastes like ash. Those include whiskey, brandy, etc.

I've only been drunk once but it was an odd experiance. Not for the effect per say, but the duration. I had 3 highballs of gin and sprite (6-8 parts gin 1 part sprite) in about 30 minutes. I also weigh 260 so it wasn't more than buzzed. I was somewhere in between slurred speech and lack of equilibrium. I also had the burning nausea sensation that led me not to want anymore.

I was totally sober 5 minutes later.

I was mostly confused by the experiance. My friends are big drinkers and, even without the nausea, I found nothing appealing about the sensation. I felt it was no different than being dizzy with a speach impediment.

#### Inappropriate Behavior

##### is peeing on the carpet
Kind of touched on this in the drug thread but I used to drink like a fish, especilly after I reached the legal age. Before I would drink a lot but usually only on weekends and it was hard to line up someone to get it. After turning 21, I drank a fifth of liquor a night for almost 4 years, then all of a sudden, I started getting sick and hangovers which I didn't get before. After that my drinking declined steadily from everyday to a few times a week, to once a week, to a couple times a month to where I'm at now which a few drinks maybe once or twice a year.
Never did the AA thing. Partly because I didn't buy the higher power concept I read about as being crucial. I just pretty much stopped on my own but it took awhile and I didn't end up in a ditch or alley thankfully.

#### Wisp

##### The Soft Rational
Abstained. For the same reason Fernando posted eariler, minus the religion. Sometimes I feel that if you do something a religion tells you do, then you forfeit your right to choose, but then I come back and remember that you CHOOSE to belong to a religion, so eh. I guess I don't like feeling bound. By alcohol, religion, or obligations.

#### grey matters

##### The Old Grey Silly One
I hated alchol when I was younger, it made me feel out of control. Now that I am older I find that I just don't care anymore.

#### p0psicle

##### Redshirt
I used to drink a lot when I was 16-18. Now I've found a balance (1-2 drinks a week or so).

#### severus

##### Well-Known Member
It all smells disgustingly awful to me. I couldn't drink even if I wanted to. Makes me gag. Probably part psychological as my father was an alcoholic, and he always smelled like beer. Sick.

#### Hammett

##### *************
Don't drink to the point of losing control but lately I've been drinking a glass or two of wine each night to help me relax.

#### FusionKnight

##### It's not my fault!
And then when I was a college freshman a couple of years ago... Most of my old friends had gone away to other universities. And the couple of new friends I started to hang out with liked to drink and go clubbing a lot, but they didn't get me at all, so I felt like shit even I was with them. Conclusion: I got totally wasted pretty constantly that year. Eventually I got sick of them... and vomiting, hangovers, waking up on the floor of strange rooms, and "cama loca" (vertigo... when you lay in bed and you feel like everything is spinning and you try to hang on to the bed to stop it, but it lasts for hours!! the most horrible sensation I've ever had in my life, for sure)
I drink casually; wine or beer with dinner, mixed drinks on occasion (rum and coke, gin and tonic), but I've only ever been drunk once. That was enough. The above description pretty much covers what it was like. Definitely worse than the stomach flu.

I could never understand why anybody would voluntarily do that a second time. I honestly would rather have died than continue having that hangover. Besides the physiological effects, it also made me feel like an idiot; I couldn't walk, talk, I babbled, and then I had to rely on other's while I was recovering, all the while looking like death warmed over.

#### Calamedes

##### Active Member
Reasons I don't (and have never) drink: I'm going to choose D) All of the above.

Although I was underage in the States (19), I was in college for 2 years and I moved to a country where alcohol is a large part of social events, coupled with food (hahaha Jews). One would think that I'd have had at least a sip of beer or something... nope. The above reasons (the hangover, vomiting, vertigo, "waking up on the floor of strange rooms", etc) have all motivated me not even to start drinking.

That and I'm afraid of addiction to practically anything. XD That's why i don't take medicine for Depression (against my parents' wishes).

#### Decaf

##### Professional Amateur
I do drink on occasion, but I tend to be the first one to stop in any social setting for similar reasons. I can enjoy the buzz that comes with a few drinks, but anything beyond that is interesting, but ultimately uncomfortable. I might spend 20 minutes marveling at how when I turn my head somewhat quickly, the picture I see in front of me is delayed ever so slightly from what I normally would see. Once that novelty wears off, I generally feel shitty. Not for physical reasons, though sometimes that's there, but just for feeling like my grace is has been surgically removed. I can no longer do things physically or mentally that make me excited (like thinking of something brilliant, writing something exactly how you envisioned it might be, dodging a mishap without external effort).

I also stay away from drugs of all kinds. Most people think its just one of my eccentricities that I refuse to take aspirin when I have a headache. I figure non-life-saving drugs have one purpose. To relieve the symptoms. That doesn't work for me. The symptoms are often there for a reason. I might have a headache because I'm dehydrated or maybe I've gotten too much sun. Fix the problem, don't hide it with the drug. That's my policy.

#### Calamedes

##### Active Member
Well said, Decaf.

#### flow

##### Audiophile/Insomniac
I get drunk mostly every weekend, I used to get drunk on weekdays as well (at a junior college, mind you). It's a great time for me, as I just read into everyone and drunkenly call people out. I'm pretty damn obnoxious, but my friends are entertained and so am I. I like to feel my inhibitions go away and just say what I wanna say to people, though I tend to be a dick. Unless of course I meet some legit people whilst drunk, in that case I'm pretty good at befriended people. So it's just win/win in my head, either I make fun of dumb people, or I befriend smart people. Hurray beer!

#### Calamedes

##### Active Member
my thoughts after reading flow's post:

"hmmmm maybe I should start drinking."

#### Wisp

##### The Soft Rational
Don't. His opinion is biased as I believe (IIRC) he is one of our two resident potheads...

I'm on the same argument you are Cala.

#### Gorgrim

##### Active Member
I wanted a huge post, but I deleted it after sittign with it for a long time. Does that happen for any of you?

either way. Drinking socially can be good. personally I Say:

1. don't drink too often.

2. don't drink too much at once.

Because too often and you'll be using alcohol to throw away all the rationality, and the mind, analyzing. What I make of that is, you're denying yourself reason to develop yourself without alcohol. Maybe it's a pain to be social, but the essence of me is suppressed when drunk, I don't rationalize and analyze much, I therefor am mroe confident, in those aspects where I would question my competence.

But with alcohol im also less able to go beyond what's right here at me. The mind slows down/get's rid of other thought processes like rationality.

To the point where you are enjoying basic instincts, and people, alot more.

This is exactly why it's amazing, and yet, I prefer to drink little, to lose the edge of my rationalization, but keep a balance of that, and thought. I think it helps, because I find myself too introverted at times, hoping to have a better balance.

Maybe alcohol is a temperary cure to many of the weaknesses we have. the alcohol is gone the next day anyhow, and it's not particularly healthy after.

never the less, I believe in balance, and moderately drinking alcohol once in while seems to help focus more on the social side than what you are used to.

#### Agent Intellect

##### Absurd Anti-hero.
i'll say this for anyone who has never drank: if i could go back in time and stop myself from starting, i would without hesitation.

#### Ermine

##### is watching and taking notes
If that's what you think, wanna try quitting? I understand it's much easier said than done, but certainly worth it.

#### Chimera

##### To inanity and beyond
I also stay away from drugs of all kinds. Most people think its just one of my eccentricities that I refuse to take aspirin when I have a headache. I figure non-life-saving drugs have one purpose. To relieve the symptoms. That doesn't work for me. The symptoms are often there for a reason. I might have a headache because I'm dehydrated or maybe I've gotten too much sun. Fix the problem, don't hide it with the drug. That's my policy.
You are my new favorite person on this forum, m'kay?

Anyway.
I'm a minor. I don't drink. I don't really have any desire to drink, except maybe if I went to dinner and wanted a glass of wine or something. And really, wine is the only alcoholic beverage I would consider consuming...
Every other alcoholic substance makes my body react negatively just thinking about it.
The thought of beer makes my stomach hurt, my nose sting, and makes my eyes ache a little.
The thought of whiskey leaves an acidic taste in my mouth.
Vodka? Sets the back of my throat on fire.
Liqueur? Makes my jaw hurt, like a bad toothache.
And I repeat: I've never had a drink in my life.
I'm sure there are countless other alcoholic drinks, but really, I think I've conditioned my mind (and body, apparently) to reject everything except maybe wine. So at this point, it hold no interest to me.
Most of it smells terrible anyway.​

#### fullerene

##### Prolific Member
*tenses up*. eeh... I'm thinkin you may have touched a sore spot there fernando...

#### Reverse Transcriptase

##### "you're a poet whether you like it or not"
My parents demonstrated what responsible drinking was throughout my childhood: a drink or two after work; a few drinks at parties. So I feel no guilt when drinking. I don't really understand when people have intense aversions to alcohol either.

If my parents were against alcohol, I might have more guilt- especially if I thought it was badly effecting me. I have said some stupid things while drunk... but I've said stupid things while sober.

I think the only time I felt profoundly bad about drinking was a night last school year. I was in my bathroom, had just thrown up, and went to take a shower. (I didn't throw up on myself- I just felt like taking a shower.) I knocked over my roommate's shampoo bottles and tripped getting in- luckily it's a very small shower so I caught myself on the shower wall. Still, I was having trouble standing. I sat/fell down and let water & self-pity wash over me.

#### Chimera

##### To inanity and beyond
*tenses up*. eeh... I'm thinkin you may have touched a sore spot there fernando...
Ja, and?
We're (generally) blunt with everyone else.
Might as well be blunt with each other too.
I think it's a valid question.​

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#### Ogion

Re: Drinking?

Ah, well, to make my appearance in this thread as well: I don't drink alcohol neither. It's a combination of not seeing any benefit in drinking it, not having found one type of alcohol that tastes good to me and never wanting to be (really) drunk. But i am no moralist or such. Everyone else should behave as wished, not my interest (as long as they don't hurt my person).

Ogion

#### Chimera

##### To inanity and beyond
That's pretty much my philosophy about it.
As long as no one drives into my living room because they were drunk, I really don't care if they're spending their Friday nights getting wasted.
And I have to admit, drunkards stumbling down the streets belting out Brittney Spears songs is pretty entertaining.

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#### Agent Intellect

##### Absurd Anti-hero.
quitting drinking is always on my mind. the part i can't wrap my mind around is logically coming to the conclusion that i shouldn't drink, but ignoring that logic and doing it anyway. on a positive note, though, i have cut back a great deal within the last 3 weeks.

#### fullerene

##### Prolific Member
we've been in each other's heads for too long... if you ever happen to come up with a good, solid reason for why you consistently do things like that that you know are bad for you, let me know asap. It'd mean a lot to me.

haha chimera, no worries... my reasons for saying that were not how they appeared. I'd be cluttering up the thread with babble if I tried to explain myself, though.