• OK, it's on.
  • Please note that many, many Email Addresses used for spam, are not accepted at registration. Select a respectable Free email.
  • Done now. Domine miserere nobis.

alternatives to MBTI

sushi

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
1,735
-->
discuss, whats good or whats bad about the mbti

whats inside and whats outside the mbti box

my arguement the mbti is useless and what is outside mbti box:

the entire human population generalized into 16 types, and descriptions that are stereotypical

test scores can be easily manipulated,

there might be more factors than 4 dictionamies extro, intro, thinking feeling, intuition/sesnse, judging/percieving

humans might be more multidimensional and might be several types combined

assumptions of types and traits might be wrong.


i curious what lies outside the mbti assessment regarding human traits and behavior that is no touched .


that being said , currently there seems to be no personality tests scores , alternatives that are better than mbti for now.
 

sushi

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
1,735
-->
AI and predictive analytics might model and categorize your personality better than MBTI in the future.

i think there is more to it than seperating the populaton to P and J as the last letter.
 

Black Rose

An unbreakable bond
Local time
Today 12:24 AM
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
10,783
-->
Location
with mama
We both,

Perceive things internally and externally
Judge things internally and externally

Perception is Intention and Sensation
Judging is Feeling and Thinking

One function is the dominant function. It is either internal or external.


I do not see where anything changes.
@sushi what is new that is being missed?
 

Artsu Tharaz

The Lamb
Local time
Today 5:24 PM
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
3,134
-->
What you said, sushi, is generally true, so mbti should not be considered as accounting for as much about a person as the community often supposes.

I personally divide people into good and evil. I so far look at sin and then go into the ten commandments.

There is also vertical typology such as Jungian archetypes and spiral dynamics.

I've heard something about a better system with 7 types or functions. It shall remain a mystery though.
 

scorpiomover

The little professor
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
3,074
-->
discuss, whats good or whats bad about the mbti
Gives us ideas about how to understand people.

Points out that different people have different personalities.

They don't talk like us. We need to communicate in other people's language.

They don't learn like us. We need to teach students in the way the student needs to be taught.

whats inside and whats outside the mbti box
What's outside: physics, chemistry, art, biology, literature, and lots and lots of other things.

my arguement the mbti is useless and what is outside mbti box:

the entire human population generalized into 16 types, and descriptions that are stereotypical
If you thought that you could categorise all of humanity into 16 types, there would be no need for MBTI to help us understand 7.8 billion people.
test scores can be easily manipulated,
Why it's silly to rely on internet questionnaires about yourself.
there might be more factors than 4 dictionamies extro, intro, thinking feeling, intuition/sesnse, judging/percieving
If there were only 4 factors, then how come some INTPs love science and some INTPs don't?
humans might be more multidimensional and might be several types combined
A multi-dimensional view of a subject is called "sophisticated".

A 1-D view of a subject is called a "charicature".

assumptions of types and traits might be wrong.
Why you should generally be distrustful of anything you read, until you've done some experiments for yourself.
i curious what lies outside the mbti assessment regarding human traits and behavior that is no touched .

that being said , currently there seems to be no personality tests scores , alternatives that are better than mbti for now.
There's the Big Five, socionics, HEXACO, DISC assessment, to name but a few.
 

Artsu Tharaz

The Lamb
Local time
Today 5:24 PM
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
3,134
-->
People are not purely one type or another, but a person's MBTI personality profile can explain/predict a lot about them.
 

BurnedOut

Beloved Antichrist
Local time
Today 11:54 AM
Joined
Apr 19, 2016
Messages
1,309
-->
Location
A fucking black hole
Firstly, Big 5 is the big papa of all the personality tests out there. Nearly every personality test out there borrows something or the other from this trait theory except MBTI, enneagram, face reading, etc.

There are plenty of ways to assess personalities. After knowing the precepts of Big 5 in mind, you can supplement your people reading skills by knowing to read body language, understand varying tones of voice, knowing to read between the lines (of text), reading history, understanding politics and having lots of interaction with people with preferably no biases.
 

Artsu Tharaz

The Lamb
Local time
Today 5:24 PM
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
3,134
-->
MBTI and big 5 are very similar to each other. (Same with various other models)

You can fuse elements of both sets of dichotomies quite easily, but with MBTI you also get the structure of cognitive configuration (function order).

So big 5 may inform you that feelers are more agreeable, but MBTI has more nuance in terms of reading and modelling people.
 

sushi

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
1,735
-->
i doubt the fbi use mbti to type classify and categorize people
 

sushi

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
1,735
-->
the seven deadly sins is a better way to classify size up criminals/strangers than MBTI
 

Old Things

I am unworthy of His grace
Local time
Today 1:24 AM
Joined
Feb 24, 2021
Messages
1,426
-->
Big 5 just tells us how people see themselves which is in relation to the rest of the population. So someone high in openness might test themseves that way if they are average in openness but are around a lot of low openness people.
 

Artsu Tharaz

The Lamb
Local time
Today 5:24 PM
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
3,134
-->
the seven deadly sins is a better way to classify size up criminals/strangers than MBTI

The seven deadly sins is absolute shit.

Read my posts again.
 

sushi

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
1,735
-->
7 deadly sins still tells more about a person's habits than MBTI

you cant deny its shit because you disagree with it, it basically is a list of fundamental weaknesses of a human being and behaivor he is prone to, which mbti whatever doesnt take in account

Lust
gluttony
wrath
greed
envy
sloth
pride=narcissism
 

sushi

Prolific Member
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
1,735
-->
i think the 16 types are still applicable but we should include notes and details that are outside the bounds of mbti. developing a whole new system probably requires aritifical intelligence and a huge sample of people to examine using big data.
 

ZenRaiden

One atom of me
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Jul 27, 2013
Messages
4,406
-->
Location
Between concrete walls
i doubt the fbi use mbti to type classify and categorize people
How would anyone not working for FBI know.

Socionics is used in Russian astronaut progams.

Psychology overall has multitude of applications, personality typology can help in various ways.

If for example you have 4 people in a tiny compartment fired into space where most of the time they do nothing, and then they are required to cooperate and make extremely detailed and perfect decisions, and observations and predictions.
You really need to know if they can stand the stress, communicate real information to others and at the same time look past some minor inconveniences.

Most ordinary day to day people will not or cannot do this.

Most ordinary people cannot even stand a bit of unfairness or discomfort, or focus with tad bit of stress. Ethical, Intelligent, Moral or not.

There is a lot of things they need to know with upper most precision about people going to space, because anything can get them killed.

And it costs shit load of money.

Plus you do not want people with panic attacks or people who are suicidal there.

Personality wise you also want to know that these people will not hold grudges, but also have an ability to resolve conflicts efficiently and get along without drowning eachother with terrible mood.

Think of how many people there are in your life who could do this.
I personally could not.

That being said BIg 5 or MBTI will not tell you much about these qualities.
 

Black Rose

An unbreakable bond
Local time
Today 12:24 AM
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
10,783
-->
Location
with mama
Lexical thinking is formalized rules thinking. Contrast (impressionistic thinking) is informal rules or patterns that are informal i.e. patterns that are new and hard to explain. creativity does not follow a rules system if new otherwise it is just calculation.

linear vs lateral thinking is easy to explain. multiple vs singular train of thought. they can be conscious or unconscious.


I am a newtype. I have high lateral thinking and high impressionistic thinking. I think in multiple ways at once and new stuff is coming into my mind all the time.
 

ZenRaiden

One atom of me
Local time
Today 6:24 AM
Joined
Jul 27, 2013
Messages
4,406
-->
Location
Between concrete walls
creativity does not follow a rules system if new otherwise it is just calculation.
Creativity absolutely follows rules, BUT...

what are rules. Language we use is based on rules.

Already established rules. Then what makes language creative?

Creativity is something you have not done before. Something you or no one has done before.

Something that was never established. That means to be creative.

Something unusual that has never happened in your mind before.

Obviously most things that are creative and of some value, cannot happen all at once all of a sudden.

There must be something some precursory activity or thought process that has cumulative effect a sort of build up that leads to the new thing that is creative.

The trouble is most of those precursory things many times don't actually have any real benefit.

Even more so many times there are no clear established steps that can give you a clue as to what is beneficial. If there were everyone would already be doing it and then why call it creativity if everyone does it......

So my point is creativity is elusive.

Also none of the thoughts or behaviors usually go in line with say productivity or benefit.

Which is why a lot of creative people tend to look like lunatics rather than orderly and efficient sensible people who are usually valued by everyone everywhere, because their value is immediate and demonstrable.

Creative endeavor begins a lot sooner than the actually positive output of the creative en-devour.

This is what many people like to call the latent phase of creativity.

If I told you to be creative this instant your chances of doing that are nil.

Because there is no space for you to create something.

God in the bible needed at least 7 days.

For most ordinary creatures like humans 7 days is not even enough to conjure up a single creative concept or original thought.

Not unless your standards for creativity are extra low. Or you mean to say that walking that extra mile ( a typical capitalistic motto to pry extra effort from people who work for you without actually benefit) is equal to creativity. It honestly is not.

Creative output must be specifically distinct from what was before.

Trouble is most times of the day we are not even aware of creative process as the process simply does not follow the actual already established process.

You might now be thinking that I am crazy to say all this when my starting point is that creativity follows rules.

Well there is no contradiction. Rules are established, but they follow a certain organizational process. They are not random, much like creativity is not random.

Obviously creativity seems random, but it has order and substance, but that substance and order are not visible to us or predictable.

Which for most people renders creativity obsolete and useless quality for immediate survival. So a big negative bias towards creativity despite the fact culturally most humans value novel and great creative solutions.

However they do not want to be the ones burdened with this unforgiving task.

So is there no rhyme or reason behind creativity?

Actually there is structure to it, and all the while that structure is not understood even by the creative person themselves the process outcome follows rules, but they are only visible after fact not before.

I should really be doing something. Its fucking dark again.
 
Top Bottom