A Rake of Weirdos (or the social game)

[sagewolf]

That's when I usually get mine cut too. It's gonna get cut soon. It's in the way, and it frizzes like mad, and it blows into my eyes and stuff. So it gets hacked off to shoulder-length.

You can wear pink if you want! As long as it's not hot pink. I'm sorry, but frankly, that doesn't look good on anyone, male or female.

 

[fullerene]

It was a dull/pale pink... but it was for a friend's graduation party, and I needed a button down shirt... so I borrowed a dressy one from my (ENFP) brother. I don't think I actually own any that fit, and I certainly don't intend on going to any more parties, so I doubt it'll even come up again.

 

[Agent Intellect]

ohmigod, i just got the really cute shirt today. its sooooooooooooooo adorable. i can't wait to see what all my friends say about it.














sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[sagewolf]

Ooh, cute shirt. Whassit look like?

A pale pink button-down shirt? That's fine! That would actually look really good, an it's got a bit of personality on a guy. They're freaks for telling you what you should wear and how your hair should be.

 

[fullerene]

psh... I try to be nice, engage the new member in a little conversation, and you would make fun of me for it.

did I mention how much I hate the culture and the expectations it lays down for us? You know... several times... a week... starting with my own intro thread, actually, if I remember right.

...my INTPness proves my masculinity--I'm not about to scurry away from girly conversation for the sake of appearances.

 

[sagewolf]

Oh. No cute shirt then? ...Now I feel like an idiot. ...Or I was trying to create the impression in other people's minds that it was serious and Cryptonia wasn't being made fun of.

...I can't read social cues. So sue me.

I've gone through my life happily ignoring culture. I was wearing boys' clothes (I liked the colours more, i think) when I was first able to dress myself. I play trumpet (and have only once been in a band where I wasn't the only female trumpeter), and I do two all/mostly boys subjects in school. No-one comments, surprisingly, except for that one kid. Oh and my mom (that's descended to the level of white noise, though.)

So does my INTPness contradict my femininity?

 

[Agent Intellect]

psh... I try to be nice, engage the new member in a little conversation, and you would make fun of me for it.

did I mention how much I hate the culture and the expectations it lays down for us? You know... several times... a week... starting with my own intro thread, actually, if I remember right.

...my INTPness proves my masculinity--I'm not about to scurry away from girly conversation for the sake of appearances.

hmmm, is there a difference between counter culture and anti culture? to me, counter culture has always been a feeling of apathy for what the status quo thought was "cool" or "in", where anti-culture seems to be more like "i look at your standards and spit on them. i'm going to do the opposite of whats expected of me".

...just a random thought that popped into my head when i read this.

i think it would be an interesting though experiment to go through all of the types and think of their roll in a hunter gatherer society and their roll in modern society. i put NF's as the social glue because they're often seen as kind of the "counselers", not necessarily being the ones that draw everyone else to them, but the ones that come up with the ideas that help to better bond people together in a cohesive society and come up with ideas to help solve the social problems in society, enabling it to stay strong.

sensors seem to be societies eyes, ears, hands and feet. they gather the raw information so that the brain (NT's) and heart (NF's) can store the information, utilize it when necessary and come up with the vision so that the sensors can carry it out. thats why SJ's and SP's have such a higher population, because society needs more of them then it needs visionaries.

 

[sagewolf]

When it comes to gender roles, I'm definitely counter-culture. ...In fads and fashion, I'm anti-culture. I refuse to do what everyone is doing-- if there's something I like and it's 'in', I'll stop doing it/wearing it/using it until it's 'out' again. (This never takes long, in my experience.) Most of the time, though, I just don't care what other people do in relation to what I do. Society's not going to live my life for me.

i think it would be an interesting though experiment to go through all of the types and think of their roll in a hunter gatherer society and their roll in modern society. i put NF's as the social glue because they're often seen as kind of the "counselers", not necessarily being the ones that draw everyone else to them, but the ones that come up with the ideas that help to better bond people together in a cohesive society and come up with ideas to help solve the social problems in society, enabling it to stay strong.

sensors seem to be societies eyes, ears, hands and feet. they gather the raw information so that the brain (NT's) and heart (NF's) can store the information, utilize it when necessary and come up with the vision so that the sensors can carry it out. thats why SJ's and SP's have such a higher population, because society needs more of them then it needs visionaries.

That makes a lot of sense, actually, wondering why the different types evolved. I need a little time to think about that and come up with what I think, but I do think I'll have something-or-other...

 

[Devercia]

I am of the opposite oppnion on the definitions. Anticulture suggests a disdain for culture itself, therefor it is apathetic. Counter culture IS a culture that is in opposition to the dominant culture. It is very common for people to conform to a counter culture rather than be original.

 

[fullerene]

^ the above was not as serious as it sounds ^
plus this forum's been doing some weird things lately, with delaying posts until much later and then slipping them in behind me (or slipping mine in behind other peoples' days later). I was just responding to AI bitterly... poor sagewolf got caught in the crossfire.

otherwise, honestly who cares what definitions you assign to the two terms as long as the concepts that you mean are clear?

By AIs definition, I'd ideally like to be counter-culture all the time... but I'm sure I've run anti- before. Actually... the line between the two isn't as crisp as I thought when I first read that one. Once something becomes popular, everyone starts doing it and the experience of the whole activity changes as a result. Something like facebook, for instance... back when it was only for college kids so many years ago, was a fantastic idea. You could see who was in your classes and college and find out a little bit about the people you were around all day very quickly. After it opens up for everyone, though, it gets clogged with new photo albums and status changes and such, and the popularity actually ruins the activity.

The same thing is true of group jokes. At one point, they're usually hysterical... which is why they become common jokes in the group. Eventually the quickest-witted person makes the best connections to reference it from, though (ENTP centered... but it can be whoever, obviously), and people tend to hang onto that person's every word until it gets old, or whatever, and eventually dies.

So I definitely get sick of things when they become popular... but not too many things stay completely unchanged as they rise in popularity.

 

[Agent Intellect]

for me, i've never let somethings popularity affect my opinion of it. whether i hate it or not. like with those 90's boy bands, i didn't hate them because they were popular, i hated them because i thought they made shitty music. i suppose i'd be lying if i said it didn't affect it somewhat. like the movie napolean dynamite, i didn't much care for it, and i think the fact that so many people thought it was great just made me hate it more. it applied to things i like, as well. in my school, it was the "in" thing to wear the big, baggy clothes. i've always worn very loose fitting clothes, but i can't say it was a conscious effort to attempt to fit in (although i'm sure i got some of it by social osmosis) i just find it to be much more comfortable then tight clothes.

 

[fullerene]

funny you should mention that... haha I've still never seen the movie, but I've been told about 8 or 9 times from 5 or 6 different people that I remind them of Napoleon Dynamite, a lot.

 

[NoID10ts]

funny you should mention that... haha I've still never seen the movie, but I've been told about 8 or 9 times from 5 or 6 different people that I remind them of Napoleon Dynamite, a lot.

If they are telling you that, there might be some ass kickings in order.

 

[fullerene]

lol yea that... er.... teaches(?) people! ...somehow.

I should say used to say that... it was only right as the movie had come out and stuff. Not having seen it, I didn't really realize it was an insult til my brother started to say I did, then held back and went "eh... well... I'll say you have some Napoleon Dynamite elements in you," as if it would have hurt my feelings if he'd said yes outright.

 

[NoID10ts]

lol yea that... er.... teaches(?) people! ...somehow.

I should say used to say that... it was only right as the movie had come out and stuff. Not having seen it, I didn't really realize it was an insult til my brother started to say I did, then held back and went "eh... well... I'll say you have some Napoleon Dynamite elements in you," as if it would have hurt my feelings if he'd said yes outright.

Well I can say nothing about you on this forum reminds me of Napolean Dynamite so that is a good thing.

 

[Ogion]

I always found it funny when people wanted to set a sign against current culture (fashion etc.) by joining another cultural group, subculture called (like the Punks, Gothics or whatever). I mean, they want to set a sign against group-culture, by joining another group instead of being their own individual...

That said i usually care quite little about what'culture' says is In or popular.^^ I consider a thing by itself (when it is something where i take the time to 'evaluate' it).

But what cryptonia said about Facebook and similar does make sense. In Linux for example i avoid what's 'popular', for example Ubuntu. For with most things, when something gets popular, most of the newcoming people (the people who come to it because it is popular) don't know anything about it and often kind of 'ruin' it...

Ogion

 

[Jennywocky]

I always found it funny when people wanted to set a sign against current culture (fashion etc.) by joining another cultural group, subculture called (like the Punks, Gothics or whatever). I mean, they want to set a sign against group-culture, by joining another group instead of being their own individual...

Other types indulge in this too, but with SJs you'll see a focus on conformity vs rebellion. Even in rebellion, they're either joining counter-cultural groups or else still just reacting to the same authoritarian framework.

(Other types join such groups for different reasons.)

It was always just so interesting to me to see that at work.

 

[fullerene]

*waves*

I'm new to Ubuntu and I have very little idea how to use linux!

...but Vista wireless wouldn't work in my dorm last year for whatever reason... so I had to change to something, and one of my friends set me up with this.

 

[Ogion]

Oh hey, though i don't use Ubuntu, i use Debian, you might say it's its father
Please, upon question just ask (me for example) Hope your one who will be tolerant to learning how to use it...

Ogion

 

[fullerene]

I'm trying. I'm actually not hopeless... like I can install, uninstall, and run stuff from the terminal... along with the basic commands. I can't do stuff like compiling from source, installing anything that's not retrievable from the repositories with a quick "sudo apt-get install ______" command, troubleshooting programs that don't work very well the first time, or (something that my friend did, for instance) doing something like mounting the Windows partition of my hard-drive onto the linux one, so that I could read all of my music off of it without having to transfer it over. I can pretty much do basic stuff and everything I need to not screw myself over too badly... but nothing fancy at all. I figure I can just look up online how to do it if anything like that ever comes up... but thanks, I'll remember you if I can't find someone else who's already asked about it first.

 

[Ogion]

Well, i did that myself too
I began (more seriously) with Linux some 3 years ago. Before that i used the computer only to play games. But we always had computers, even in the beginning of the 90's. I came to learn computers on DOS, experimented with the sourcecode of nibbles in qbasic with some 6 years or so . So upon coming to Linux the terminal was familiar to me. And i just started using it and upon encountering a problem i just read about it in many sources (like manpages, forums and stuff...) and try and error.
I am in no way a linux guru, but i can handle myself and most problems i can solve on my own, without having to ask. It is more fun to get to the solution on your own, then to get it told (I guess you see it similar...)

Ogion

 

[grettiron]

this thread is a great example of divergent thinking! that is, all the fuck over the place.

but to answer the original post:

Do other people think you're weird?
i suspect so. my closest friends say so, but they get to see things that nobody else does.

Do you downplay it or exaggerate it?
sometimes i feel strange because i'm not like the others, and i do try to downplay it. i'm still trying to get the hang of things. first order of business: stop being honest. it's not gonna get me anywhere in life i don't think.

Do you just not bother?
in day to day life i generally don't have to be social, so yeah, i usually don't bother.

 

[sagewolf]

Other types indulge in this too, but with SJs you'll see a focus on conformity vs rebellion. Even in rebellion, they're either joining counter-cultural groups or else still just reacting to the same authoritarian framework.

(Other types join such groups for different reasons.)

It was always just so interesting to me to see that at work.

I found myself thinking that about a year ago. I've had friends who were skaters, and goths, and preps, sporty-happy-girly-girls, and it occurred to me at one point that I didn't fit any group.

Immediately followed by "But why would I want to?" My name wasn't 'skater girl,' or 'goth'. I don't mind saying I'm nerdy, but I'm not a nerd. I'm not part of a group constructed to give slightly-less-mindless-than-normal drones the illusion of uniqueness. (I had a big argument with my English teacher about that. She said a certain character had a great deal of personality, and that he was very individualistic. To me he was just another punk.)

 

[Perseus]

I'm weird and proud of it. And luckily, at each school I've been to, there was always the "odd" clique, so I was just fine. I was still weirder than most of the people in the "odd" clique. I didn't really bother to fit in with anyone else, and fitting in wasn't required in the "odd" clique.

And it's great walking barefoot on concrete in public. It makes me feel freer than everyone else. And that reminds me, that it's weird how many public buildings require shirts and shoes, but they never say anything about pants! Anyone want to experiment on this? jk

Although I think the Weasel is a malignant form of ENFP, being weird is just the Fates. If that is your fate and you don't want to be weird, act out an auxiliary function. Don't go religious or else they will transform you against your will. Probably turn you into a Dog (ISTJ), the trusted one. This is a Guard. Your girlfriend will want this, especially if she is Cat (ISFP) who will be unfaithful.

Going malignant is a valid route. It usually makes the person unhappy if it is a permanent mode. It makes everybody else unhappy as well. But it may pay the bills.

 

[Agent Intellect]

Although I think the Weasel is a malignant form of ENFP, being weird is just the Fates. If that is your fate and you don't want to be weird, act out an auxiliary function. Don't go religious or else they will transform you against your will. Probably turn you into a Dog (ISTJ), the trusted one. This is a Guard. Your girlfriend will want this, especially if she is Cat (ISFP) who will be unfaithful.

Going malignant is a valid route. It usually makes the person unhappy if it is a permanent mode. It makes everybody else unhappy as well. But it may pay the bills.

huh?

 

[Jesin]

huh?

I second that.