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16 types, 16 smiles: The way thinking and feeling functions effect the smile.

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It's because people still have facial and body expressions in still shots. You will have facial expression even in a still shot unless you're dead; for example, smiling, frowning. How else would someone be able to say things like "that person looks like they're sad" in a still shot photograph? They're not determining a person is sad based on whether they have prominent eyelids or other permanent physical features. They determine it by the facial and body expressions that manifest through things like physical tension and creasing in the face and body.
 

cheese

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I believe they've changed their stance on that. How else can they do reads with pictures only? There are no cues.
They don't do reads with pictures only. There are some expressions/facial muscle configurations characteristic to certain functions. The pictures posted are just demonstrating typical expressions. No reads are made off pictures; these celebs have been typed through video afaik.

The presence of a double lid (what you called the 'flap') doesn't indicate anything. "Hooded eyes" doesn't refer to a physical trait but to a dynamic expression through time. That might be a bad way of explaining it, but I'm 99% sure they don't read off facial features, though down the road we might find there is some correlation.
 
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It's because people still have facial and body expressions in still shots. You will have facial expression even in a still shot unless you're dead; for example, smiling, frowning. How else would someone be able to say things like "that person looks like they're sad" in a still shot photograph? They're not determining a person is sad based on whether they have prominent eyelids or other permanent physical features. They determine it by the facial and body expressions that manifest through things like physical tension and creasing in the face and body.

Even the dead have facial expressions, most often related on how some died.
Something i have noticed, how weird it may sound. I better start reading books again instead of looking at that.
 
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Even the dead have facial expressions, most often related on how some died.
Something i have noticed, how weird it may sound. I better start reading books again instead of looking at that.
Hehe this is a cool point, just goes to show how much expression is physically animated in a still shot of someone.
 
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They don't do reads with pictures only. There are some expressions/facial muscle configurations characteristic to certain functions. The pictures posted are just demonstrating typical expressions. No reads are made off pictures; these celebs have been typed through video afaik.

The presence of a double lid (what you called the 'flap') doesn't indicate anything. "Hooded eyes" doesn't refer to a physical trait but to a dynamic expression through time. That might be a bad way of explaining it, but I'm 99% sure they don't read off facial features, though down the road we might find there is some correlation.
I am positive that they believe "hooded" eyes = Extraversion. I'd like an explanation from
Adymus.
 

cheese

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Hooded eyes actually = a subjective mojo, ie an introverted one. And hooded eyes are not single-lidded eyes, that's a static physical feature. Actually he addressed this somewhere, that hooded eyes don't refer to the way the lid hoods the eyes, but something else. I can't remember where but if you look through his posts you'll find the answers. Or you could just join the Pod'lair site and ask them.

*edit
INTP Forum - View Single Post - Pod'Lair VS MBTI/JCF

And especially this:

Adymus said:
Okay physical facial structuring is not important to reading people, this isn't VI, this is Mojo Reading. You can have big bulbous bug eyes and still be a subjective Mojo, it is not the literal physicality of how you look that define your Mojo. We use words like "Hooded" and "Unhooded" to describe Subjectives and Objectives in very simple terms, but that actually doesn't have anything to do with how physically big or small their eyes are, it describes the nuanced signals that comes from a person that naturally gains momentum from a power that engages itself with the outside world or inner world.
And this:
http://www.podlair.com/podlair-home/simplified-method

Especially:

Pod'lair said:
Objective/Subjective: Even among those who share the same perception power, there is a difference in the way Objectives (oriented toward the external environment) and Subjectives (oriented toward the inner world of the psyche) appear. Subjectives have a “hooded” or “going in” look (as seen with Cristina, Jonathan, Adam, and Thomas) while Objectives appear “unhooded” or “out” (like Christina).
 
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Hooded eyes actually = a subjective mojo, ie an introverted one. And hooded eyes are not single-lidded eyes, that's a static physical feature. Actually he addressed this somewhere, that hooded eyes don't refer to the way the lid hoods the eyes, but something else. I can't remember where but if you look through his posts you'll find the answers. Or you could just join the Pod'lair site and ask them.

*edit
INTP Forum - View Single Post - Pod'Lair VS MBTI/JCF

And especially this:



And this:
http://www.podlair.com/podlair-home/simplified-method

Especially:
So I was right?
 
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"Hooded eyes" refers to the general expression of the eyes that only subjectives ("introverts") have. It's physiologically manifests, like facial expression, but its not a physical feature like the shape of an eyelid. "Hooded eyes" is a slang referring to this physiologically manifesting expression. For example, someone who has hunched shoulders all the time might be that way because they have a habit of tension (look up "Alexander Technique" for an example), not because they have a physical disability that forces their muscles to hunch. Physiological manifestations like "hooded eyes" are like this: they are always present in the way the face is used but this isn't because of the physical makeup of a subjective/introvert, it is because of their neurological configuration that causes them to use their body a certain way.
 
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"Hooded eyes" refers to the general expression of the eyes that only subjectives ("introverts") have. It's physiologically manifests, like facial expression, but its not a physical feature like the shape of an eyelid. "Hooded eyes" is a slang referring to this physiologically manifesting expression. For example, someone who has hunched shoulders all the time might be that way because they have a habit of tension (look up "Alexander Technique" for an example), not because they have a physical disability that forces their muscles to hunch. Physiological manifestations like "hooded eyes" are like this: they are always present in the way the face is used but this isn't because of the physical makeup of a subjective/introvert, it is because of their neurological configuration that causes them to use their body a certain way.
So pod'lair is backed by neuroscience now? Where's the proof? In the first "Cognitive Functions 100", Adymus was ripping off scans/images from Lenore Thomson's "Personality Types: An Owner's Manual". Where is the proof?
 
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Perhaps part of the confusion on this board on the use of these terms is because they've been used by Adymus at times without him clearly defining what they mean. Another trouble is that a lot of these physiological cues are subtle "flavors", like the flavor of someone's facial expression looking sad. We don't have too much trouble communicating the idea of someone's face looking sad because we've all seen it and are used to identifying it, but isn't it pretty challenging to truly accurately describe the facial expression of one emotion? Precisely how the face tenses up and so on to show that expression. Yet nobody would say, just because it is hard to concretely define, that sad facial expressions don't exist. The cues in Pod'lair work the same way, but the trouble is we don't have common knowledge words of the cues in question. So while the cues can be experientially observed and absorbed, it's as hard to communicate those observations as explain say, a martian or someone autistic the physiological cues of an emotion that most people can read in someone's face like bitterness or sadness.

I think this is part of the frustration that both people on the INTPforum and Adymus feel when trying to describe or understand this phenomenon, and also why NFs do tend to naturally excel at it. This subject is inherently challenging to communicate the ideas too, and I think this is where a lot of the frustration and misunderstanding happening in this forum is coming from. The only thing I can request is that if everyone (I don't want to single anyone out) chills out and talks to each other more respectfully, and even if they "know" they're right to not talk on those terms, then maybe we can have a more productive and less antagonistic discussion about this system. I think the system itself is really interesting, and it systematizes a lot of physical cues I've noticed (more from gut feeling) for a while now, so I'm interested in it, and I wish we could talk about it more in-depth than we can here right now with the flaming or aggressive writing. It was more like that earlier in this thread when we weren't trying to prove to each other who was right!
 

cheese

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Huh? Who's flaming?

Masterlord:
No. Read the links and the quotes. They answer your questions. If you have more questions maybe you should PM Adymus or just look through his postings, or even go to Pod'lair's site. If it's proof you're looking for, I doubt you'll find it, at least not without training and experience, and that's only a shaky sort of proof imo. The problem of pod'lair's evidence and proof and backing has been discussed numerous times. Why not look through those threads if you're curious.
 
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Huh? Who's flaming?

Masterlord:
No. Read the links and the quotes. They answer your questions. If you have more questions maybe you should PM Adymus or just look through his postings, or even go to Pod'lair's site. If it's proof you're looking for, I doubt you'll find it, at least not without training and experience, and that's only a shaky sort of proof imo. The problem of pod'lair's evidence and proof and backing has been discussed numerous times. Why not look through those threads if you're curious.
This is fucking bullshit - Not interested.
 

Puffy

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Calm down dude. If you're right and they're wrong then how should it affect you - you have pointed out they are a very small organisation, of which you believe they can't expand. Leave it be. If it works you up so much I'd reflect on what it is that annoys you so much.
 

cheese

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You said:

I am positive that they believe "hooded" eyes = Extraversion.
Pod'lair says:

podlair said:
Objective/Subjective: Even among those who share the same perception power, there is a difference in the way Objectives (oriented toward the external environment) and Subjectives (oriented toward the inner world of the psyche) appear. Subjectives have a “hooded” or “going in” look (as seen with Cristina, Jonathan, Adam, and Thomas) while Objectives appear “unhooded” or “out” (like Christina).
You also wondered if the presence of a double lid indicated Extraversion in pod'lair theory.

Adymus said:
physical facial structuring is not important to reading people.....You can have big bulbous bug eyes and still be a subjective Mojo, it is not the literal physicality of how you look that define your Mojo.....that actually doesn't have anything to do with how physically big or small their eyes are, it describes the nuanced signals that comes from a person
So essentially Hooded does not indicate extraversion, and facial structures are not relevant in people-reading. I'm not sure what the problem is. Have I misunderstood the question? Or do you not want me to answer? (Although these are their words directly.) Or are you rejecting Pod'lair's claims? (I'm not arguing for them, just presenting.)
 
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@Adymus
Kristen Dunst is soooooooo ISFJ. She's not an ENTP. I've been watching her since many years. If u typed her just by looking at her pictures that's a mistake, but u already said that u wont be typing people just by looking at pics anymore so it's fine. If u typed her by watching one of her videos, then u either rushed it or u must have got confused coz both the types have the same cognitive functions. Please check your results again before posting it.
 
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Here's my normal face.


The rare cheerful INTP look? If I am in fact INTP... I'm not sure, and if I am I think I'm likely still borderline some of the other types and not full out INTP.
 

QuickTwist

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Here's my normal face.

The rare cheerful INTP look? If I am in fact INTP... I'm not sure, and if I am I think I'm likely still borderline some of the other types and not full out INTP.
I bet you get scary when you take off your glasses.
 

QuickTwist

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Lets talk about fake smiles. Do F types or T types fake smile more often?
 

Rixus

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Lets talk about fake smiles. Do F types or T types fake smile more often?
I usually try not to betray a lot of feeling at all, but I've partnered people feel more comfortable if you give them a little smile, but I have to remember to. So feelers probably do it a lot more.

Anime - No it does not look fake. I don't know what you're like in RL, but your posts show more emotion then any other poster. And it doesn't seem fake at all.
 
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I bet you get scary when you take off your glasses.
A little bit lol!

No-glasses (and 5am mad scientist hair) reaction to your post.

I would describe that more as my "amused grin" that I make when confident and secure. TBH the "cheerful" smile I posted earlier is more like a nervous/vulnerable smile that I would make if I'm getting tickled or I feel like I'm being put on the spot.
 
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I am ENFP - do me smile fake it look?

I don't have energy to read thread right now, very tired.

I don't think it looks fake. But I would say that it expresses enthusiasm/excitement which are emotions that I don't really experience or at least not strongly and those aren't the emotions that are associated with my smiles.
 

Rixus

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Morning smile before coffee.
Technically it's completely fake, because I would describe my emotional state right now as completely neutral.

 

Rixus

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And at least you didn't tell me to shave or pluck my eyebrows like my ISTJ workmate always does.

Him when I became single: "Try having a shave. Iron your clothes, smarten yourself up, have a shave like. It's so untidy. Look, see, clean shaven." (Strokes his own chin.)
 

QuickTwist

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And at least you didn't tell me to shave or pluck my eyebrows like my ISTJ workmate always does.

Him when I became single: "Try having a shave. Iron your clothes, smarten yourself up, have a shave like. It's so untidy. Look, see, clean shaven." (Strokes his own chin.)
Smarten yourself up?

What a complete and utter asshole!
 

QuickTwist

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A little bit lol!

No-glasses (and 5am mad scientist hair) reaction to your post.
I would describe that more as my "amused grin" that I make when confident and secure. TBH the "cheerful" smile I posted earlier is more like a nervous/vulnerable smile that I would make if I'm getting tickled or I feel like I'm being put on the spot.
I'm glad to make you feel confident and secure.
 
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And at least you didn't tell me to shave or pluck my eyebrows like my ISTJ workmate always does.

Him when I became single: "Try having a shave. Iron your clothes, smarten yourself up, have a shave like. It's so untidy. Look, see, clean shaven." (Strokes his own chin.)
I'd tell you the same :p

If you were my friend irl, that bad boy would have been waxed against your will already.

For your own good.
Hoping you understand.
 

Rixus

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I'd tell you the same :p
Should any hot date take place, I shall consider shaving first. Be warned, though. I'll consider it, but probably decide against it. I may pluck the middle of my eyebrows a little. If you're lucky.
 

Rixus

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Shave daily, though? Fuck that. The fact that I can be bothered to shower daily is a miracle.
 
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